Backcountry Eating
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@zeitgeist 10,00000000000 studies on the health promoting effects of beta glucans btw and a whole wall of cope instead of just admitting that saying oatmeal is only a medicinal food is just weird
Ray more than once or twice completely incorrectly cited studies in his articles and actually wrote the EXACT OPPOSITE conclusion of the study he referenced to support his article, so your copes about ray's criticism of scientific studies is just funny when I know for a fact ray didn't carefully read all of the very studies he referenced
it's just oatmeal, man. oatmeal is like one of the most inoffensive and lightest to carry when hiking and provides magnesium and carbohydrates in a filling and easy to cook way that is especially suited to camping. im sure milk powder is totally fine too, in fact combining milk powder with the oatmeal is probably a really good camping meal. you're just doing too much about this topic
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@sunsunsun There are hundreds of studies on the benefits of PUFAs and the unhealthiness of saturated fats. The same goes for fiber, serotonin, “T4 supplementation is enough” and many more core pillars or antipillars of bioenergetics. If you argue that Peat came to the opposite conclusion which the study claimed, provide a source.
The magnesium argument is unsound, I explained the antinutrient role of phytic acid - oatmeals deplete magnesium, not increase it. I also made the effort to go through the famous pro-oatmeals studies you mentioned and explained why their approach in conducting research is wrong, you did not refute any of that, only simply said that Ray made mistakes as well (without offering any examples). Also, it is not a cope, I thoroughly explained my disagrement with the studies, the one who is dismissive is you.
They are filling, sure - but if the world offers better alternatives, why stick with a suboptimal option? I am not saying they are poisonous, like in the case of nuts (which are also often recommended for hiking and considered healthy overall).
The way in which I interact with this forum is to find the best available methods, substances or foods to better my health, productivity and happiness. Sure, if the only option were oatmeals, I would say take the oatmeals. That however, is not the case.
We do not live in a severely starving society, at least I hope so. We have access to some of the greatest resources on health available, our options with potential remedies that are to our disposal are endless. Why stick with the flawed when the possibilities are limitless? We shall strive for new heights, remain cautious of becoming prideful, but otherwise try to do things which were thought impossible before.
With such a mindset that you seem to endorse, you limit yourself to the paths available.
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@zeitgeist you are a johnny come lately (which is fine, everyone finds info at their own pace) who hasnt even carefully read ray’s work to find the glaring errors he made
re: the oat study criticism
did ray not in one email to someone say to start with a small amount of cow’s milk, for someone with milk digestion issue, to let the body acclimate to dairy?
but when it’s oats that cause a digestion issue the entire food itself is bad and theres no acclimating according to you. 100g of dry weight oats is not a small amount.the phytic acid cope is just the same as from carnivores
one shotted by peatosphere like i said
saying studies arent to be relied upon when they dont support your opinion when ray ends his articles with a league of citations is weird, man. especially when i know for a fact ray has cited studies incorrectly
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@sunsunsun I am starting to think this discussion is becoming futile. You did not deal with any of my arguments, which there were many. Your only counter-arguments are “cope”, “weird” and “one shotted”. No constructive criticism was offered.
I never said “ studies arent to be relied upon”. I am not sure where you got that idea. I merely pointed to the flaws which the studies you mentioned have, not once did I say that you should not rely on studies. Or do you think that studies are faultless? That scientists do not make mistakes or act in bad faith? Luckily, many of the shortcomings can be uncovered simply by reading carefully (as I did with the pro-oatmelas studies). Again, you did not offer any rebuttal, you merely dismissed it as
As for your milk argument: Yes? How can you not see that that is a completely different situation? Milk is one of the most nutrient-heavy and beneficial foods which this planet has to offer. Adaptation to lactose does not cause any long-term negative effects, it does not inhibit your thyroid nor does it slow your metabolism/decreases your overall ATP. Once you start producing enough lactase, the problem disappears.
With oatmeals it is quite different, the endotsoxin IS problematic and remains problematic even after it sits in your intestine for five years, the “adaptation” is pathological. Your overall T3 and protective hormones decrease while the negatives accumulate.
How is the phytic acid cope? You did not disprove anything I said. If you are so adamant that I am wrong, explain yourself.
Please provide your examples of Peat being wrong with citing studies incorrectly. If you are so certain and mentioned this repeatedly, you can surely offer them right?
Also what peatosphere are you talking about? There is no RPF anymore, no podcast or any other prominent community. The only semiactive thing is this, which many times go against Peat’s core work with stuff like glp-1, pufa reintegration, severe hormesis or fiber advocacy.
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@thebiooracle Thanks for the idea, on this last mission I went on I just brought my massive resealable bag of milk powder and portioning it out would actually probably be a better idea. Also, I've never had much ghee before, I did on this latest trip take in some coconut oil and it seemed to travel well but maybe I'll try out ghee on the next trip I go on. I do tend to make sure to carry granulated sugar in my food sack alongside some salt and various spices to season whatever I end up making out there. I'll have to sift through the archives to see if Ray Peat has mentioned anything else about shelf stable foods.
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@Jennifer Raisins are a classic, but I usually carry dates as a nice trail snack, I can get them for a good price at the nearby grocery stores. As for everything else you've mentioned thanks for the ideas! I'm usually short on time since I tend to find out I'm going out into the backcountry maybe a few days before I head to the Trailhead, but at this point I think I should invest in learning how to dehydrate some stuff instead of buying whatever I can find at a store for sure.
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@sunsunsun phytic acid chelate nutri
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@SilvertipConch Peat did describe how he made his milk powder pancakes in one email: "I just mix them according to the consistency that I want, a thick batter for puffy pancakes, with just milk powder and egg and a little salt, or a thinner batter, with a little liquid milk added, for crepes; fried in butter." Ghee would do fine for the butter out there. In another one he said "With any powdered milk it’s important to find out whether an anti-caking agent was used in making it." Might be worth checking the label on that big bag.
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You’re welcome, @SilvertipConch.
I like dates, too, especially covered in white chocolate and sprinkled with some coarse salt. If you like chocolate, it’s super easy to make and another good use for the powdered milk:
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