T3 thyroid hormone increases PDK?
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PDK4 is also the strongest to inhibit pyruvate dehydrogenase. What is going on here? Can this effect be ameliorated with high sugar diet ? There was also another study stating hypothyroidism increased PDHa activity in rat brain
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This has got me so curious now too.
https://www.e-dmj.org/journal/view.php?number=135
I think the state of hyperthyroidism they’re talking about increasing fatty acid oxidation which does in fact block PDC.
But I’ve also heard thyroid is crucial for that link reaction to the kreb cycle.
Hopefully someone with a bigger brain can chime in
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@thyroidchor27 said in T3 thyroid hormone increases PDK?:
PDK4 is also the strongest to inhibit pyruvate dehydrogenase. What is going on here? Can this effect be ameliorated with high sugar diet ? There was also another study stating hypothyroidism increased PDHa activity in rat brain
That article is some extra fine quality mumbo jumbo. I went to the full article and couldn't decipher it either. Here's what I do know:
Pyruvate dehydrogenase:
"Pyruvate dehydrogenase complex (PDHc) is a thiamine dependent key enzyme for energy production which catalyses decarboxylation of pyruvate into acetyl CoA for the Krebs cycle.1"Please note the thiamine dependent part.
If you take too much T3, you can cause hyperthyroidism. Hyperthyroidism is known to cause thiamine deficiency. Revving up the metabolism without providing the additional vitamins/minerals needed will cause deficiencies. If you have a thiamine deficiency, you won't be able to utilize pyruvate dehydrogenase for energy production.
Consuming lots of carbohydrates (including sugars) will lower your thiamine stores and can make you thiamine deficient. Without enough thiamine you will be unable to convert the carbs (and the fats too) into energy via the Krebs cycle.
Some people do develop genetic changes (or they are born with them) that make the attraction of the Pyruvate dehydrogenase for the thiamine co-factor weaker/less effective. This problem can be resolved by providing more thiamine via supplementation.
"Can this effect be ameliorated with high sugar diet ? "
I doubt it. The high sugar diet is going to lower the body's thiamine stores.
Please know that the study you linked to is not discussing thiamine; it is discussing pyruvate dehydrogenase and genetics that affect the function of pyruvate dehydrogenase. It is my understanding that thiamine deficiency can cause epigenetic changes which can cause the need for additional thiamine. So my comment here may not even be in the ballpark.
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@mostlylurking right I though excess fatty oxidation could also lower PDH / increase PDK as happens in cancers. So high sugar plus high thiamine may reverse this effect
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@thyroidchor27 said in T3 thyroid hormone increases PDK?:
right I though excess fatty oxidation could also lower PDH / increase PDK as happens in cancers. So high sugar plus high thiamine may reverse this effect
I don't know.
Thiamine is also used in the burning of fat for metabolic fuel.
I have been taking high dose thiamine hcl (1gram, 2Xday =2grams/day) for 3 years. I never stopped drinking milk & OJ. I did stop drinking coffee and eating gummies. I do eat potatoes and occasionally a little white rice. I'm not a fan of "high sugar" though.
Is this a philosophical discussion or is somebody in particular sick?
If you research it, thiamine in low doses is believed to be carcinogenic whereas thiamine in very high doses is believed to be anti-carcinogenic. The area in between (100mg to maybe 1500mg/day) is believed to be neither.
Linking vitamin B1 with cancer cell metabolism
High Dose Vitamin B1 Reduces Proliferation in Cancer Cell Lines Analogous to Dichloroacetate
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@mostlylurking why are you doing the high dose protocol? Are you taking other vitamins as well as thiamine reduces the bioavailability of those? Have you any experience with benfotiamine instead of HCL
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@thyroidchor27 said in T3 thyroid hormone increases PDK?:
why are you doing the high dose protocol? Are you taking other vitamins as well as thiamine reduces the bioavailability of those? Have you any experience with benfotiamine instead of HCL
I have heavy metal poisoning, mainly mercury. Yes, I'm taking other vitamins as well. I don't have any experience with benfotiamine, sorry. I have also tried TTFD and sublingual thiamine mononitrate. I like taking high dose thiamine hcl; it has given me my life back. I follow Dr. Costantini's protocol. for my thiamine hcl dosage.
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@mostlylurking thank you. Have you tried ALA and fiji water (silica) for the mercury? It seems particulary good for those. How was your experience with TTFD? Is thiamine HCL the best?
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@thyroidchor27 said in T3 thyroid hormone increases PDK?:
@mostlylurking thank you. Have you tried ALA and fiji water (silica) for the mercury? It seems particulary good for those. How was your experience with TTFD? Is thiamine HCL the best?
I have not tried ALA. I have drunk gallons of Fiji water (silica water), but it is my understanding that it bonds/removes aluminum, which I have, but not mercury.
TTFD gave me a headache that lasted 36 hours because my glutathione level was very low.
https://www.hormonesmatter.com/paradoxical-reactions-with-ttfd-the-glutathione-connection/
So I stuck with taking thiamine hcl; I follow Dr. Costantini's protocol. I do well on it. Taking it has normalized my glutathione level which means (to me) that the thiamine hcl has resolved my high oxidative stress.
I don't think that there is a "best" single thiamine. I've read Elliot Overton say that if one type of thiamine works for a person that they should stick with it. My husband takes TTFD thiamine, 200mg/day and is doing well on it.
