NAD Infusion Alternatives
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NAD infusions are being used for anxiety disorders, depression, substance use disorder, and more. Typically at these clinics it will be administered for six to ten days in a row. The time and monetary cost prohibit the accessibility of this treatment.
There have been reports of similar effects from niacin and niacinamide. However, there is a definite difference between the IV NAD and plain oral B3 vitamin. Personally, my anxiety and depression vanished for a few days on niacin then it came back.
The NAD is a molecule of B3 bound to adenosine. I took inosine, uridine, and caffeine. All related to adenosine and uric acid in the body. My depression began to lift dramatically. Suddenly I got kidney pain and vomitting and had to stop. That happened the second attempt too.
When IV NAD is administered, people feel a significantly elevated heartrate and tightness in the chest. This is the signiture effect of the treatment. If a molecule can be developed and taken orally to have this same effect, then we will know a mimetic for this treatment has been created.
Here are my current ideas:
Use DIY iontophoresis to trandermally absorb NAD powder. Drawback is potential heavy metal impurities like 0.01% aluminum contamination being absorbed which I am uncertain about.
Chemical synthesis of NAD prodrugs. Perhaps attaching NAD to adamantane or gaba, like picamilon with niacin.
My third idea is to take B3 alongside maybe an ethyl or ethyl ester form of adenosine or inosine. This could potentially avoid the nephrotoxic effect. Care should be taken around adenosine because it can shut down the heart when injected into circulation, ER doctors use this to normalize certain heart conditions.
Fourthly, baking soda may assist the kidneys with handling a large amount of oral inosine. -
If raising NAD levels is your main goal then I wouldn't use the nicotonic acid version of B3 because the flushing is going to be a significant roadblock to you getting a therapeutic dose. NA is better for raising histamine and lowering methylation.
I think nicotinamide (niacinamide), or nicotinamide riboside, is the best oral version of B3 to raise NAD levels. (R) It seems to work well in pretty much every human study I've seen. But, I suppose the IV solution has a level of intensity that can't be matched with oral alternatives.
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@Mulloch94 said in NAD Infusion Alternatives:
If raising NAD levels is your main goal then I wouldn't use the nicotonic acid version of B3 because the flushing is going to be a significant roadblock to you getting a therapeutic dose. NA is better for raising histamine and lowering methylation.
I think nicotinamide (niacinamide), or nicotinamide riboside, is the best oral version of B3 to raise NAD levels. (R) It seems to work well in pretty much every human study I've seen. But, I suppose the IV solution has a level of intensity that can't be matched with oral alternatives.
I have used niacinamide and NR. It seems like the nucleosides and or uric acid are the important factor in some cases. We know inosine favorably impacts the NAD/NADH ratio. We know Ray Peat was very favorable about uric acid being healthy, prometabolic, an important endogenous antioxidant, anti-inflammatory compound. I have heard that in an inflammatory state the NAD enzymes don't work as effectively as they should. Maybe a cocktail of powerful anti-inflammatories that reach the brain would be worth trying.
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@basebolt Perhaps, but I would get your thyroid checked. The most powerful anti-inflammatory is CO2 and low thyroid will cause low CO2. Carbon dioxide will also shift the metabolism from reduction to oxidation, increasing NAD. CO2 is also anti-adrenaline and anti-serotonin, and can "kill" the overly charged sympathetic nervous system. The "sympathetic" response is quite literally the disease state.
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there is also the potential for "paranasal" administration of NAD+ powder.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=jEw3Ff_o4PM&t=8937s
put NAD powder in some water with a pinch of baking soda. position yourself properly then tilt head back and put the solution into nose. hold that solution at the back of your throat/nasal cavity for twenty minutes with your head back.
note: I am not sure how safe it is. I have heard of cases of brain infection occuring through the nasal route.personally I have done this a few times and am not comfortable with doing it more unless the NAD can be sterilized without destroying it
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Have you tried NMN? I feel it has a slightly stronger effect than NR, however I have only taken NR orally in a capsule while I took NMN as a sublingual dissolvable tablet. There's probably no substitute for intravenous NAD but sublingual NMN supposedly enters the bloodstream directly.
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@AstralPMP said in NAD Infusion Alternatives:
Have you tried NMN? I feel it has a slightly stronger effect than NR, however I have only taken NR orally in a capsule while I took NMN as a sublingual dissolvable tablet. There's probably no substitute for intravenous NAD but sublingual NMN supposedly enters the bloodstream directly.
Have not tried it yet
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No luck yet with chemically synthesizing the NAD prodrugs. Additionally, I've heard absorbtion is not great above 500 dalton molecular weight, which NAD itself is about 660.
There is a chance that vitamin E will enhance plain NAD by the way Ray Peat has spoken of. Additionally, an endogenous conjugate of the two has been found. It is called tocopheryl nicotinate. Perhaps tocopheryl NAD will be formed somehow.
For making progress on the DIY iontophoretic application of NAD, I need to explore the ways of protecting against heavy metal impurities. Much of these ions are positively charged and will enter the body alongside the NAD. If anyone has suggestions, I'd like to hear.
Soon I will be testing a theory about high dose inosine + caffeine + uridine + adenine + niacin being able to have the same effect as the NAD IVs (the compound is made up of B3 + adenosine so it makes logical sense to try this). In the past I got a decent result of my near lifelong absence of an appetite suddenly returning but then intense lower back pain and vomitting prevented me from continuing. This time I'm adding baking soda, vitamin E, salt supplementing, and magnesium.
This is mostly to update on the progress.
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Perhaps it would be worth looking into eye drops with NAD+? You would try dissolving raw NAD+ powder into a super saturated yet eye safe solution, and putting a few drops in each eye.
Benefits would be felt in the brain the quickest, due to law of locality.
