@lobotomize-me If you need to become numb then you can try propranolol

@alfredoolivas

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31381816/

Derivatives of brassinosteroids are known to be anti-estrogenic (studied for breast cancer)

@alfredoolivas Its structure is similar to Brassinosteroids. Those are the active ingredients in "pine pollen" supplements.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brassinosteroid

@alfredoolivas

I think that the lipophilic derivative of caffeine, pentoxifylline should be even better in that regard than caffeine.

Pentoxifylline

Caffeine

@Mauritio

Any reason to go with 5AHL over Tribulus Terrestris?

@Mauritio

The paper you linked refers to the synthetic 5-alpha-hydroxylaxogenin.

That compound is different from the naturally occurring laxogenin, which is used in Chinese medicine.

In fact, the FDA has declared the sale of 5-alpha-hydroxylaxogenin (5AHL) in supplements to be illegal:
(https://www.usada.org/spirit-of-sport/illegal-ingredient-5-alpha-hydroxy-laxogenin-supplements/g)

5AHL is thought to be synthesized from diosgenin, so perhaps that is where you're getting the association.

Now, although the study you linked was about the synthetic derivative, one thing did catch my eye about the structure of laxogenin.

Laxogenin

6-OXO

Notice how both compounds have a ketone group on position 6. The latter (6-OXO) is known to be an effective aromatase inhibitor and significantly increased the concentration of T and DHT when given in doses of 300 or 600 mg/day to men.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2100070/

The 6-OXO is a suicidal AI, and it's obvious that the 3 unsaturations in the A-ring allow it to have that property.

It is possible that Laxogenin might also function as an AI if somehow the necessary double bonds were introduced when it gets metabolized. I doubt that can happen though.

It is also possible that laxogenin also has its own anabolic or androgenic activity independent of aromatase inhibition.

@alfredoolivas 7.2 grams 11KT per bottle, 29 doses per bottle

@Mauritio

Patrick arnold is still selling 11-KT.

Pretty expensive, but here it is

https://prototypenutrition.com/collections/all-products/products/11-kt-spray-original-formula

Generally, the more orally bioavailable a steroid is, the more hepatotoxic it is.

The hepatotoxicity is a measure of how resistant the steroid is to the liver’s attempts to metabolize it.

Why does anyone think that 4-8mg of androsterone is hepatotoxic? What’s stopping the liver from attaching a sulfate group to it to make androsterone sulfate?

@alfredoolivas lol