The pro-metabolic effects of ultrasound
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Very nice find!
You shouldn't have cut off the d) and e) series of mice photographs. Or maybe you purposefully did to tease us, given the many sensations already? Aaaaw, how plump and full of hair those treated mice are in comparison to the fragile control group! And then the videos really emphasize the differences even more. Impressive. Phew.
The treated mice look kind of surreal wrt to that they evidently exhibit the body structure of aged mice but are buffed-up and full of shiny fur.The most effective ones were the groups that received the least ultrasound
That's cool!
32.2 kHz at 4 kPa for 30 min with a duty cycle of 1.5 s on and 1.5 s off
Bold and original decision and based on original in-vitro findings by the authors!
That's up my alley. Such parameters I could warm up with: Frequencies "just" above the auditory range and long pulses.
-> I've tried to find such an ultrasound device but it seems the I-Tech Mio Sonic from Italy you had found is already on the lowest spectrum and a good one in wide comparison:
Other devices I could find cost at least as much even if looking really cheap and they don't even declare their energy output but it's probably high. They are being pictured for cosmetics use with women using them around their face to treat wrinkles and rub in lotion, pointing them at their temples and sidewards to their eyes. The "professional" devices for medical practitioners costs thousands. They blast up to 3000mW/cm² with a high 150mW/cm² as their absolute bottom setting. The "LIPUS" devices are a subgroup among the devices for medical professionals and are standardized to 1.5MHz, 30mW/cm² pulsed and marketed for fracture healing (for which they are a little controversial, and otherwise on-par with LLLT).
It made me feel all nauseous, really.
It seems such a device has to be built by oneself. -
@CrumblingCookie said in The pro-metabolic effects of ultrasound:
You shouldn't have cut off the d) and e) series of mice photographs. Or maybe you purposefully did to tease us, given the many sensations already?
Lol you gotta keep em engaged, don't you ?
@CrumblingCookie said in The pro-metabolic effects of ultrasound:
Aaaaw, how plump and full of hair those treated mice are in comparison to the fragile control group! And then the videos really emphasize the differences even more. Impressive. Phew.
The treated mice look kind of surreal wrt to that they evidently exhibit the body structure of aged mice but are buffed-up and full of shiny fur.Yeah it's wild how shiny their fur is! That and the increased activity are impressive.
@CrumblingCookie said in The pro-metabolic effects of ultrasound:
Such parameters I could warm up with: Frequencies "just" above the auditory range and long pulses.
Yes and it also kinda lines up with peats recommended 50-100 kHz.
That part I cannot replicate, since my device only goes with 1MHz but at least the intensity is somewhat similar.
It's interesting that there need to be a pulsing to optimize the benefits. For once in the actual treatment but also in the sense that it should be cycled (twice a week seems optimal) .
That reminds a little of the pulsed treatment with Yamanaka factors in mice, which showed similar results.@CrumblingCookie said in The pro-metabolic effects of ultrasound:
Other devices I could find cost at least as much even if looking really cheap and they don't even declare their energy output but it's probably high. They are being pictured for cosmetics use with women using them around their face to treat wrinkles and rub in lotion, pointing them at their temples and sidewards to their eyes. The "professional" devices for medical practitioners costs thousands. They blast up to 3000mW/cm² with a high 150mW/cm² as their absolute bottom setting. The "LIPUS" devices are a subgroup among the devices for medical professionals and are standardized to 1.5MHz, 30mW/cm² pulsed and marketed for fracture healing (for which they are a little controversial, and otherwise on-par with LLLT).
It made me feel all nauseous, really.
Thanks for trying anyways.
That would've been my next step, to look for a device with lower frequency. -
@Mauritio said:
Thanks for trying anyways.
That would've been my next step, to look for a device with lower frequency."Conflicts of Interest
Authors (M.S., S.K.K., F.M., B.B.R. and R.M.) are co-authors of patents related to these studies, and M.S. and F.M. have financial interests in a company, Mechanobiologics Inc. that is planning to market LFU devices suitable for senescent cell rejuvenation in vitro and in vivo."
Researching the schematics and electrical parts list aside I am wondering how that whole-body treatment could be achieved. In the study they placed the mice on top of a plastic mesh on top of a distancing cylinder in a large beaker filled with water, so that the mice were half-submerged in water and in the far-field of the transducer, i.e. in a relatively homogenous ultrasonic field.
Simply dipping a custom-built transducer at the foot end into the bathtub wouldn't be anywhere as homogenous.
Perhaps place a super-wide-beam transducer at the bottom middle of a bathtub and put a plastic sunlounger on top to lay on. Or integrate it into one of those fancy costly floatation pods.Does anyone know how to convert those 4kPa power approximately to on-skin mW/cm²?
From looking at the supplemental figure 1 one can see that it's well possible to invest time and effort yet to no or little avail by having the parameters just crucially off: Too much pressure/power (anything above 4kPa) and there's no effect. More on- than off-time pulsing and the effects decrease. A different frequency and there are none of the wanted effects. Too little duration and there's no or little effect yet too frequent repetitions of the same and the effects dimish too.
The supplemental table S2 states the us treatment is strongly antiserotinergic: Peatarians, assemble. Whereas I don't know what to make of those strongly upregulated viral infection processes in table S1. -
I wonder if the water is not playing a role in the 29 month old mice who are showing signs of reversal of age? For instance, water can be structured many different ways, (red light, vortexing, filtering through rock like media). I wouldn’t be surprised if the ultrasound is structuring/energizing the water, and it’s the mice being bathed in this substance that is exerting the effects.
I have heals many maladies in the past simply structuring water and then soaking my feet in that water. For whatever reason that I can only guess about, my best results have always come from using sea-water, (structuring that, and then soaking my feet in that). The results are systemic. A rough patch of skin on say my knee is returned to normal by soaking my feet. An increase in energy, (not driven by cortisol) can be observed by soaking my feet.
I say all of this to say: water may be playing a key role in these findings, (though if ultrasound is capable of structuring fluid, the fluids of the body may suffice too). I just personally have had remarkable success with “bathing” in structured water.
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@Mauritio how’s this experiment going? I’m interested in hearing your observations when you have a moment.
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@evan-hinkle I've only tried it twice and it caused strong hypoglycemia but my face also looked kind of rejuvenated.
Right now I've got more pressing issues I've got to take care of but, I'll be back at it soon .
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@Mauritio thanks for the update. Looking forward to when you have the opportunity to do more!
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@Mauritio so if 50 to 100 thousand
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@Mauritio said in The pro-metabolic effects of ultrasound:
Right now I've got more pressing issues I've got to take care of but, I'll be back at it soon .
What has become of your ultrasound endeavors and findings in the meantime?
By chance I've stumbled upon another kind of "miracle" device by a Greek / US professor Panos T. Pappas called the Papimi ion inductor. It allegedly restores cellular viability as a type of PEMF pulsed electromagnetic field device (of which there are many). What made that one stand out to me is that it produces very short burst of only 1/1,000,000 second durations of a very wide spectrum by plasma excitation in its applicator (which is a coiled, gas-filled tube) and repeated at only 2-5 bursts per second (2-5Hz). Which reminded me of the thread we had been going here.
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@CrumblingCookie In my height growth thread, there are instructions on how to create a PEMF device for under 200 euros and with no engineering knowledge required
