The processing of MILK and unsaturation
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I'm on a road trip now, and leaving my beloved raw milk source and discovering what's out there, and forced to read the label. As I found some milk gave me gas and a filmy mouth, you have to wonder what goes in there.
So obviously the milk fat is skimmed off to the legal minimum but what I didn't know is that it is also watered down to the legal minimum. The amount of milk solids is carefully controlled too. From my raw milk provider:
Claravale Farm milk goes from the cow, to the bottle, to you. Other milk may be pasteurized (cooked), homogenized (processed so the cream won’t rise to the top), adulterated with synthetic vitamins and other additives, and standardized. Standardization is the process used by all major producers where milk is separated into its constituent solids and fat, partially dehydrated, and then mixed back together to form a product which just conforms to minimum legal limits for milk.
My home state California has different and superior standards for milk.
The moment I crossed into Nevada, I got some milk at a convenience store like an alcoholic in withdrawal and walked out with a big grin on my face, to be utterly disappointed, and depressed at having got scammed, when it tasted like water. Despite claiming 150cal/serving
Well, the other thing I can look at is the nutrition label, and I noticed, iirc (in saturated fat/total fat, grams per serving) Kirkland Signature organic A2 milk to have 6/8, Staters bros market 5/8, Anderson's Dairy 4.5/8, Mountain Dairy 5/8. What's happening here? I swear regular milk used to say 7/8. And Peat said that the rumen destroys most of the unsaturation. Here's what I found.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwXtKUCMG-g
They are deliberately feeding cows seed oils straight to increase the unsaturated fat content.So they've found a way to really adulterate milk.
My second time buying milk in NV, I tilted the jug to read the label, and it started leaking from the cap. I grabbed another jug and there was a plastic spike on the bottom, which stabbed me deep enough in the fingerpad to draw blood. Since the price of organic, grassfed milk cost 4x, and I'm doing milkvestigation at this point, I made my boyfriend take the third jug, and fortunately it doesn't taste like water. But the other things are suspect....
But yeah milk is not just plain beautiful delicious milk anymore, what a pain in the ass
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@penis said in The processing of MILK and unsaturation:
So they've found a way to really adulterate milk. (...)
But yeah milk is not just plain beautiful delicious milk anymore, what a pain in the assExcerpt from a more complete answer:
- If you see 3.5 g fat for full-fat milk, it’s probably an aldultered one.
- An organic label doesn’t protect us if the milk is UHT treated.
- Try to avoid the deconstruction/reconstruction process.
- Search for the term VAT (vat-pasteurized = slow-heated) in USA and check the fat type when mentioned.
- The difference between Pasteurization and UHT is not just a matter of degrees; it is a fundamental change in the molecular shape of the milk: protein integrity, enzymatic activity and CLT / stearic acid fat types.
- A cow fed with corn and soy during the winter time (6 months) suffers more from systemic inflammation. A ruminant needs fiber to optimize pH and avoid a compromised stomach barrier (LPS problem)
- In short: the cow’s rumen is a master-filter that turns polyunsaturated fats into saturated ones, but it needs the “scratch factor” of grass to keep its stomach lining intact. Six months of corn and soy essentially trades a healthy, diverse lipid profile (like CLA) for a more inflammatory one.
More details in this post:
English corner: Homogenized milk Vs pasteurized milk.
How to choose the right milk in a warehouse
https://mirzoune-ciboulette.forumactif.org/t2179-english-corner-homogenized-milk-vs-pasteurized-milk#30671 -
Actual milk has between 3.5% and 4.0% fat, depending on cow breed. But in America it seems even milk sold as "whole" milk, isn't actually whole. I checked the "whole" milk sold at Walmart and it only has 3%. For comparison in German supermarkets whole milk will always be either 3.5% or 3.8%.
All that removed fat is used to make cream or butter. It's just another way of trying to increase the profit margin of the product.
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@pittybitty said in The processing of MILK and unsaturation:
For comparison in German supermarkets whole milk will always be either 3.5% or 3.8%.
If no other solution, see if it's pasteurized or UHT. No UHT at all (fake protein).
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@pittybitty Yeah absolutely criminal they lie about not watering down milk, we just recombine it to the minimum, it's totally not the same! Whole milk should be 3.25% in USA at least.
I went to Walmart the other day and since there were lots of unsaturated fats in the milk I got the fat-free milk, thinking it has less seed oil toxins. It tasted drinkable at first but I was sipping water for the next half hour due to the aftertaste. I think it was so bad it gave me nightmares, cause I woke up in the middle of the night and was stuck ruminating over it, until I decided to get out of bed, pour out the Walmart "milk", and eat some food.
Then I went to costco and their UHT Organic a2 milk doesn't have the burnt taste some other UHT milks have. Peat was probably right recommending sourcing on taste, given a regular budget and how little information is provided with most milk, best not to be drinking uppackaged walmart-quality.
Sourcing raw milk is difficult but I'm going to aim for some on this road trip. The best tasting milk I have ever had was grass fed VAT milk but it was extremely expensive.
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@penis said in The processing of MILK and unsaturation:
Then I went to costco and their UHT Organic a2 milk doesn't have the burnt taste some other UHT milks have.
The best tasting milk I have ever had was grass fed VAT milk but it was extremely expensive.
Haven't you still matched: UHT, even if this one tastes fine has fake proteins.
VAT milk has been flash pasteurized and should be less adulterated. Less in not OK. I gave links on my forum where to buy appropriate sources in USA.
And I wouldn't trust the word "organic" here. -
@LucH said in The processing of MILK and unsaturation:
I gave links on my forum where to buy appropriate sources in USA.
Thanks for this information. Of these three, do you have a preference? I've seen all three at Sprouts, and used to buy Straus, but the glass bottle deposit is psychologically hard to deal with...haha! It adds a significant amount each time, and you have to hassle with returning the glass bottles. It seems you prefer the A2, if I read correctly. Sprouts also has raw milk, at $19/gallon. It sounds like you think flash pasteurization is just about as good as raw.
· Kalona SuperNatural — only cream, no milk (Midwest/National): They are famous for being non-homogenized and vat-pasteurized at low temperatures. While they often use plastic or paper for their larger sizes, their smaller specialty batches and glass options are the "least handled" on the mass market.
· Alexandre Family Farm — $21.30/gallon (West Coast/National): They focus on A2 milk. Their 6% Whole Milk is a standout because it is not standardized—they leave the fat exactly as it comes from the cow (which is why it’s 6% and not the "legal minimum" 3.25%). Look for their glass bottles in high-end grocers.
· Straus Family Creamery — $15/gallon + deposit for two bottles (West Coast): A pioneer in glass bottling. Their cream-top whole milk is non-homogenized and minimally processed. They are very transparent about their "small circuit" collection from local family farms.
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@Mossy said in The processing of MILK and unsaturation:
It sounds like you think flash pasteurization is just about as good as raw.
Yes, nearly. The third one seems fine.
I don't want to look parano but if you don't want tiny / nano plastic particles, a glass bottle is better. Alzheimer prevention. I do not buy plastic bottles for my daily water drink, except for the coffee machine (espresso) (less Ca).
Here for milk, I don't think it's a real problem: shorter storage. Never more than 6 months for water storage.A2 milk is easier to digest and people encounters less reactive immune responses.
More difficult to find too, except by a local farmer.
But I won’t drink a UHT A2 milk, even if it’s labelled organic (bio, here in French language).
As explained on the given link the difference between pasteurization and UHT is not just a matter of degrees (temperature); it is a fundamental change in the molecular shape of the milk: protein integrity, enzymatic activity and CLT / stearic acid fat types.
If you buy "Organic" from a major supermarket, it has likely gone through the exact deconstruction/reconstruction process we should try to avoid.
If you buy usual A1 milk, available in most warehouses, you should buy “Vat milk” (flash pasteurized). not the UHT oneVocabulary: Vat pasteurized
Raw milk is heated in a vat or tank to 145°F (63°C) and held there for 30 minutes. Usually more expensive than conventional milk and often found in specialized or local markets.
Here in West-Europe, the conventional one is a flash-pasteurized one but often deconstructed (low fat < 0.5 g) and afterwards reconstructed to get half one (0.5-2 g fat) or full-fat one (3.5 g). Not fine too.
If I see 3.5 g, I don’t buy it, even if it’s labelled “bio”. It's an adulterated milk.The Result: The Vat pasteurized milk retains its ability to be used for cheesemaking (clotting) and stays +/ biologically similar to raw milk. It isn't "shattered," just "sanitized."
But to remain objective, some people would react to both types – we’re not talking about lactase enzymes – but about immune memory. When we force the body to accept sth it can’t digest well, we weaken the ground. (…)
When I see people drinking one liter milk (2 gallons), they should know they play the game for an immune reaction. I don't say anything since I don't want to be labeled as a troublemaker (un empêcheur de tourner en rond => leave me alone, I know ... Boring...)Technical explanation A1 Vs A2 milk.
Histidine is the amino acid in A1 milk that causes more difficulty in digestion compared to A2 milk. In A1 milk, this amino acid is found at position 67 of the casein protein, which allows the breakdown of the protein into the inflammatory peptide beta-casomorphin-7 (BCM-7). A2 milk has proline instead, which prevents this formation.
In short:
A2 Milk: At the same position (67), A2 milk has proline. Proline does not break down in the same way, preventing the production of BCM-7 and making it easier to digest. -
@LucH said in The processing of MILK and unsaturation:
Haven't you still matched: UHT, even if this one tastes fine has fake proteins.
@LucH said in The processing of MILK and unsaturation:
But I won’t drink a UHT A2 milk, even if it’s labelled organic
The other option, unfortunately, is no milk. VAT is as hard to find as raw milk in my limited experience. I don't have fridge space for and can't return glass bottles, nor can I pay huge amounts for milk. I have considerations such as sourcing, price, and space to consider here. We sleep in the wild and generally avoid passing through the big cities full of options. It happens my fridge can store 3 half-gallon cartons (which is what costco sells) but not two one-gallon jugs, It is not my ideal choice and you should not focus on it.
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@penis said in The processing of MILK and unsaturation:
The other option, unfortunately, is no milk. VAT is as hard to find as raw milk in my limited experience. I don't have fridge space for and can't return glass bottles, nor can I pay huge amounts for milk.
OK then. But I'd limit the take to one portion 240 ml (half a gallon) a day. Less is best here. Extrapolation. Try to target the acid-base balance (specially potassium) and you'll need less milk.
Eat one portion cheese too. -
A single portion (240ml) of UHT milk is like welcoming just one tourist in Venice. Not overcrowded. You get the value of the nutrient, but the load is manageable, allowing your small metabolism to process and keep the not-well-fit amino-acid under control (not used).
If someone overloads himself with one gallon at a time, twice a day, it won't make you "more nourished." It will make you tired and leave your body feeling crowded and overworked by the demands of processing it all, when something is not well manufactured / recognized. Management is all. Even if you don’t perceive it. And don’t tell you know someone who …
Finally: Think, perceive and act, as someone not far from here would say
“If UHT milk is the only option, a single portion (~240 ml or half a gallon) is manageable. Think of it like one extra car on a quiet road — the system absorbs it without stress. Moderation keeps the metabolism in control. A moderate amount keeps the metabolism in control of what it can process and discard.
