Why do you believe in God?

Truth

@Norwegian-Mugabe No distinction between a being and a thing (such as a stone) in this argument? If there is, what contributes to the perception of "god" as a "being" rather than a thing (such as a stone) in this idea?

Norwegian Mugabe

@Truth again the arugments differ on this. Kalam's argument does not say what kind of being/force it would be that created the universe. Anselm of Canterbury's argument certainly states that God must be the greatest possible being.

Truth

@Norwegian-Mugabe Which of these two is part of your idea of "god"?

zawisza

This post is deleted!

Norwegian Mugabe

@Truth Both of these arguments are valid arguments for God. Kalam's argument is perhaps the greatest argument of all, but this argument does not state much about the kind of being God is.
If you truly want spiritual wholeness and develop a deep relationship with God, then I reccomend spending time hiking in nature. If you sit in silence in nature you will feel in your gut what purpose you should take on. I also reccomend to train yourself to be a lover of beauty. Listen to classical music and make your surrondings as beautiful as possible.

Truth

@zawisza Lolol, it doesn't matter if we're not on reddit, or if my name is Truth instead of socrates

I'll keep asking elementary questions, Even if you please me not to

According to you it's obvious, keep reading and you'll potentially realize that there are aspects and nuances of his idea of "god" that aren't necessarily mentioned or explained in the initial post

Lolol it's you who comes across as a fanatical buffoon who tries to label people who ask questions about "god" as "heretics"

I don't care about "Christian theology" and "saints", I ask the questions to the guy who made the post

I block you

Truth

@Norwegian-Mugabe

From my experience, I suggest that "god" in the majority of cases is a feeling and/or feelings associated with ideas,

the higher our energy level,
the more we feel united with everything, the more we feel united with "god", or even that this unity we feel within us, and of which we are a part, is "god" or "divine" energy, to the point where we no longer perceive it as something "greater" or external to us

We can also experience a certain degree of masculine energy, which is associated with a high enough degree of sovereignty, fertility, power, free of any negative emotions, where we feel we embody the energy of life creation, we no longer think of all the potentially sub-optimal ideas associated with "god" that arouse suboptimal emotions, we no longer think of "god",

we feel that we are "god" (in this second state, the feeling of "divine" energy is felt individually, rather than as part of everything)

Norwegian Mugabe

@Truth you touch on Schopenhauer's view of objectivity nullifying the burden of the will, and Nietzsche's idea of will to power. Both ideas hold truths, but neither give an explanation of the universe. I think many people seek God to explain why the universe exists, rather than to seek God to live better. Your views are similar to Oneness Pentecostalism, exepct maybe you aren't a Christian? I think of us as an extention of God.

I think you are wrong regarding the ideas part. Yes you can reason yourelf to a closer relationship with God, but sensus divinitatis tends to come from transcendental momements of beauty and ovebecoming.

zawisza

This post is deleted!

Truth

@Norwegian-Mugabe I'm not a "Christian",

I wasn't implying that reasoning can lead us to a higher degree of feeling oneness with "god" or of being "god", I was simply saying that in the majority of cases (of people I've observed) belief in "god" is associated with sub-optimal ideas, which arouse negative emotions

Norwegian Mugabe

@Truth I would think that the ultimate sub-optimal belief is to not have answers to the most fundamental questions about being.

Truth

@Norwegian-Mugabe From my experience, I suggest that what matters most is that we reach the highest degree of energy and well being ourselves and potentially the greatest number of people, are these questions about existence associated with a higher degree of well being in the majority of cases, from my experience it is not

Is it necessary to ask these questions in order to reach the highest degree of energy and well-being, in my experience it isn't, and tending to the highest degree of energy and well-being can commonly be associated with a cessation of these questions about existence

Truth

@zawisza I have a message from "god" :

You're wrong.

Norwegian Mugabe

@Truth I can see your point of view. I think there is a big difference between believing as a coping mechanism, and the people who starts to believe in God cause they want to seek something higher. Almost all the best men in history has been chrisitians. The heroic worldview of CS Lewis and JRR Tolkien could certainly enrich people's life. Yet, I can see that going to your local lesbian mass might provide neither answers nor strength.

As far as just focusing on energy metabolism, I do not see any point in this outside of God's plan. People have a various need for answers to the ultimate questions. Many do not want to simply be a cog in the machine without some base understanding and a greater purpose at hand. So there are reasons for wanting to believe in God, and there are great arguments for God's existence as we have provided earlier in the thread. Therefore, we should believe in God.

Truth

@Norwegian-Mugabe That's why I asked you these questions, to find out if the meaning you personally give to "god" was only a thing that would have caused the manifestation of the universe, or a being with intentions, which seems to be the second in your case

Norwegian Mugabe

@Truth Yes, I believe in the second one. It seems right to me. I am happy that you showed interest. It does not bother me that people ask question about my believes.

Truth

@Norwegian-Mugabe in my experience, i suggest Whether it's believing in God as "coping mechanism" or "seeking something higher", it can be the lesser evil in the short/medium term in a person's given environment and what they're exposed to that's useful,
In the long term, it's associated with a sub-optimal energetic state

I don't know if the majority of the "best" men in "history" were "Christian", it's possible that they achieved the best they could in their given environment, it is not a comparaison,

I'm talking about an optimal state that each of us could reach in my experience

As long as fear and submission(and potentially other negative emotions such as guilt and shame) are considered necessary and/or virtues in "god's plan", then achieving the highest degree of energy and potentially optimal Masculinity(in part sovereignty)is necessarily opposed to "god's plan"

The more humble and contrite a person is, the quicker they find God in ways that are only relevant for them. This requires humility and hunger.

Most importantly, I've experienced Several miracles
1.) A cyst fell off my nose in a worship service when I was a teen, with brand new skin underneath.
2.) I went to heaven in several dreams (I'm sure most people will doubt that was more than brain synapses).
3.) Several children in kids ministry in my church prayed for my friend's finger to grow back after he cut the end off while cooking; new meat and skin bubbled back right there under their eyes.
4.) My Pastor laid hands on a guy with white hair to pray for him, and his hair color returned, shaped as the hand print where the pastor's hand was (they were not praying for hair restoration).
5.) I've seen demons with my naked eye. I have never taken hallucinogens.

One of my friends was a former leader in a very perverse community, making a whole lot of money, that my friends converted with street ministry, via supernatural prophetic insight, telling him things that only he could know -- these stories are increasingly common.

Many friends have experienced the above in various ways -- especially seeing real demons in broad daylight with the naked eye.

I don't expect anyone who doesn't want to, to believe me. I now find arguments almost useless. Experience is the most dangerous threat to atheism -- encounter and exposure coming to a town near you

Truth

@BronzeAgePater Hi, how was your dream in "heaven"?

Why do you consider experiments a "dangerous threat" to atheism?

@Truth bro thanks for asking. It was like I was a child, exploring a sort of open world playground of nature, more beautiful than anything I was ever exposed to. Love was like a tactile life force, in a way that couldn't be described in human language. Editing to add all that I could about the feeling: it was such a powerful emotional experience, it's like a childhood version of marrying the love of your life and cuddling with your parents and taking a dopamine hit all the same time --it was the profoundest feeling of acceptance.

Sorry you misread me: "experience," not experiments. Experiencing a Divine encounter that cannot be reconciled with human knowledge is a sort of trump card. I knew an edgy Dawkins-atheist type, who became a believer, when a 12 foot demon manifested in his room one day.