did taking Armour the Peat way at night worked for you?
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@Jennifer said in did taking Armour the Peat way at night worked for you?:
Have you noticed any sleep improvements with dietary changes?
My diet style has been very similar for years. Since opening to Peat ideas I eat more carbs less fat and a bit less protein. I thought initially eating more carbs especially at night would help with sleep, but most of the times I still wake up a couple of times during sleep,
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I'm not so sure TSH recover that fast after stopping/reducing T3 or NDT, I mean I'd like to think that.
In the study I'm attaching below, a single 50mcg dose of T3 lowered TSH for several days. Now, 50mcg all in once is a huge dose, perhaps 5/10mcg at the time won't have same effect.
what do you think?
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My pleasure, @jamezb46.
I see, @GRay. You’ve increased carbs and decreased fat and protein, but have you experimented with different carb and protein sources? I ask because I, and other people I have worked with to optimize their health, have discovered that some sleep well with simple sugars and dairy as their main carb and protein sources, while others sleep better with starch and meat, especially the glycine-rich, as their main sources.
Without knowing the test subjects’ thyroid functions in the study you linked or how accurate blood values as a measurement are compared to isotopes in the study Ray referenced, and not having the study, since he mentions it in email exchanges with other forum members, I can’t answer you with confidence, but the results aren’t that far off from each other, anyway. Just for reference, here are the email exchanges:
“[TAKING THYROID WILL HAVE LONG-TERM EFFECTS] Experimenters using isotopes gave large doses of thyroid until the subjects' glands were completely shut off, and when they stopped giving the doses, everyone's gland returned to normal activity in just 2 or 3 days. The gland is extremely quick to adjust its activity, both up and down, except when it's inhibited by stress, or PUFA, or estrogen, etc.
[HOW TO STOP THYROID] If a person's thyroid gland has been inhibited by very high doses of a supplement, it takes only 2 or 3 days for the gland to resume full activity, and because it takes time for the hormone to be excreted, suddenly stopping a supplement shouldn't be noticeable, when the gland isn't being inhibited or malfunctioning.”
— https://expulsia.com/health/emailexchanges#Long_Term_Effects
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@Jennifer said in did taking Armour the Peat way at night worked for you?:
I see, @GRay. You’ve increased carbs and decreased fat and protein, but have you experimented with different carb and protein sources? I ask because I, and other people I have worked with to optimize their health, have discovered that some sleep well with simple sugars and dairy as their main carb and protein sources, while others sleep better with starch and meat, especially the glycine-rich, as their main sources.
I haven't really experienced that much. I tried few times to add more dairy with milk but I can't tolerate it. It would be so easy to get protein and carbs in with milk, but I get constipated. Raw milk is a little bit better. Cheese seems to be ok with me, I eat 2/3 oz per day.
I eat 140gr of carbs from white rice divided in half lunch/dinner, the rest of my carbs is fruit honey. Do you think a safe trial could be replacing the 140gr of rice carbs with plain sugar?
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@Jennifer said in did taking Armour the Peat way at night worked for you?:
Without knowing the test subjects’ thyroid functions in the study you linked or how accurate blood values as a measurement are compared to isotopes in the study Ray referenced, and not having the study, since he mentions it in email exchanges with other forum members, I can’t answer you with confidence, but the results aren’t that far off from each other, anyway. Just for reference, here are the email exchanges:
“[TAKING THYROID WILL HAVE LONG-TERM EFFECTS] Experimenters using isotopes gave large doses of thyroid until the subjects' glands were completely shut off, and when they stopped giving the doses, everyone's gland returned to normal activity in just 2 or 3 days. The gland is extremely quick to adjust its activity, both up and down, except when it's inhibited by stress, or PUFA, or estrogen, etc.
[HOW TO STOP THYROID] If a person's thyroid gland has been inhibited by very high doses of a supplement, it takes only 2 or 3 days for the gland to resume full activity, and because it takes time for the hormone to be excreted, suddenly stopping a supplement shouldn't be noticeable, when the gland isn't being inhibited or malfunctioning.”
— https://expulsia.com/health/emailexchanges#Long_Term_Effects
thanks for your thoughts. I heard Ray mentioning this before
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You’re welcome, @GRay.
Milk is problematic for the majority of people I communicate with so I understand. Do you have any digestive issues when not consuming milk? If so, it may be worth it to trial the white sugar for a brief time, sure. Or even fruit juice with no additives like ascorbic and citric acid, since it has vitamins and minerals that can aid sleep, but is also free of starch and fiber like refined sugar. Either way, it should tell you if starch is problematic for you or not. -
@Jennifer said in did taking Armour the Peat way at night worked for you?:
Do you have any digestive issues when not consuming milk?
I do. It has been for about 4 years that I'm dealing with something.
I went to a gastroenterologist and we thought a possible SIBO as my symptoms were sometime diarrhea after eating, plus constipation and bloating. We tried a course of Xifaxan but did not resolve the issue. Gasto then said it could be IBS, and suggested a probiotic.
I started the MegaSpore since it is Peat friendly, and It did helped immediately with the diarrhea symptom. At some point I even saw my stool forming normally but it did not resolve the issue. I'm not really sure if it is doing anything right now.
I still often complaining about not "empty" out well and constipation, and my stool not forming that often either.
I have been trying the carrot salad and mushroom for a while, with the latter more effective to get rid of constipation. -
Oh, okay, @GRay. In cases of SIBO, diarrhea indicates an overgrowth of hydrogen producing bacteria and constipation indicates an overgrowth of methane producing bacteria so the standard treatment involves Xifaxan for hydrogen producing bacteria and Neomycin for methane producing bacteria. It can take many courses to eradicate the overgrowth so if you do have SIBO, one round may not have been enough for you. Haidut mentioned up to 3 months. My doctor prescribed me a month long course and my SIBO persisted, but because each course costs over $2,000, my insurance wouldn’t cover more rounds. Thankfully, getting on thyroid and optimizing my dose helped eradicate it.
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thanks for the info.
My Xifaxan course was for 2 weeks only. How would you know if I have SIBO or IBS? can you actually have both?
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You’re welcome, @GRay. To diagnose it, doctors typically order a breath test, but a comprehensive stool test can also detect it, however, depending on where you live, the latter is considered more alternative testing so it isn’t always covered by insurance and can be quite pricey—it cost me $1,000. I don’t know if it would be classified as IBS, but bowels could certainly be irritable if an overgrowth is present. Due to doctors misinterpreting the results of my breath test and the SIBO going untreated for years, I developed such a severe case of gastritis that raw fruit was the only food that wasn’t a trigger, and even then it was only certain fruit and the fruit had to be juiced. I spent at least 2 hours a day juicing. Thankfully, a new doctor reading my file caught the error.
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I’m glad you have resolved your gut issues. It seems to be a bit complicated resolving gut issues.
I just had a visit with my gastro today. We want to try another course of Xifaxan along with Neomycin this time, funny we just talked about this yesterday. He mentioned some potential side effects from Neomycin to watch for.
He did mentioned the SIBO test being very expensive and not covered by insurance, so at the moment it is not an option for me.
He is not comfortable to do more than 2 weeks course at time. I will have a follow up in 4 weeks see how things are, perhaps trying another course later.
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@GRay when did Ray recommend this? Did he recommend this approach to someone specifically?
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No idea, perhaps @Jennifer knows more about it.
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What a coincidence, @GRay. Fixing my gut was easy after discovering that I did have SIBO. From there, I went on thyroid and did a fairly restrictive, SIBO elimination diet and within 8 weeks I had cleared the overgrowth and was tolerating foods I had developed a severe allergy (anaphylaxis) to. Anyhow, fingers crossed the combination of Xifaxan and Neomycin does the trick.
I’m not sure if Ray recommended that approach to someone specifically, but he said that the body normally makes about 4 mcg of T3 per hour so if you take 5 mcg or 10 mcg with food, it won’t cause stress by going far beyond the normal physiological concentration. Since half a grain of thyroid contains 4.5 mcg of T3, having it with food aligns with his dosing recommendation.
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@Jennifer said in did taking Armour the Peat way at night worked for you?:
Anyhow, fingers crossed the combination of Xifaxan and Neomycin does the trick.
thank you.
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@Jennifer said in did taking Armour the Peat way at night worked for you?:
I’m not sure if Ray recommended that approach to someone specifically, but he said that the body normally makes about 4 mcg of T3 per hour so if you take 5 mcg or 10 mcg with food, it won’t cause stress by going far beyond the normal physiological concentration. Since half a grain of thyroid contains 4.5 mcg of T3, having it with food aligns with his dosing recommendation.
we chatted about dosing Armour few weeks ago. I was on a similar dosing protocol as yours, half grain before breakfast and lunch. I tried then to add a 1/4 before dinner.
Initially I thought it was not causing any sleep disturbances and felt good, but after a couple of weeks I thought it did. I stopped it and I believe I was falling a sleep better.
I tried again with the extra 1/4 this time at bed time, but I seem to have the feeling of not sleeping while I'm sleeping, and waking up over and over.
Do you have any recommendation for this issue? how would you try to time my Armour? I'm listening everyday a podcast with Ray on the Thyroid to draw some info dosing with the Armour, so far a host mentioned to be taken twice daily since the half life of about 8hrs
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@GRay, have you tried taking the 1/4 grain earlier in the day with your breakfast or lunch dose or perhaps you need extra calories, particularly carbs, when taking an extra 1/4 grain?
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@Jennifer said in did taking Armour the Peat way at night worked for you?:
have you tried taking the 1/4 grain earlier in the day with your breakfast or lunch dose or perhaps you need extra calories, particularly carbs, when taking an extra 1/4 grain?
I didn't. I was thinking to try to take it at 3/4pm maybe, since I tend to get sleepy around that time, or maybe just taking the full grain in the am, then the 1/4 around 3/4pm.
Perhaps I will try it again before bed with extra carbs
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@GRay are you getting enough calcium? Are you consuming liver and oysters once a week? These are pertinent for your nutritional needs
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I do everything, thanks for checking on this. Since Peating I have increased my Ca to about 1500mg tot, some from cheese and the rest from Oranges and Bone Meal supplement
