The Informal School of Bioenergetics
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I am looking to develop a more structured regiment for people that aren't interested in pursuing a formal education or a degree in the biotech/biochem field, but would like to educate themselves a little bit more seriously.
When discussing Georgi Dinkov's background, in which he mentions working for a Biomedical Research Foundation, we can find a good structure for learning. He worked with a team of 40-50 people; some of the brightest doctors, biochemists and geneticists in the U.S as well as in international institutions. He developed an interest for the field and received several book recommendations from these experts, as well as attended lectures and researched PubMed articles and studies.
I believe @haidut serves as a good example for what can be achieved with the willingness to learn. My goal is to develop a structure from this aside from all the Ray Peat specific resources we already have on other threads and the vast amount of information involving Peat's work individually. A lot of the info I have seen has been associated with nutrition and lifestyle. I was hoping to organize this as you would a university curriculum. Including what could be the basics in Biology, Chemistry and Lab to the more advanced and specific sections of these(Physical Chemistry, Metabolic Regulation, Biochemistry, Physics, Organic Chemistry, etc).
I did some searching around the forum and couldn't find anything similar, only a suggestion to make a thread just like this, hence the post. Perhaps some of the users here can assist me with some suggestions for the structure and material that should be included.
Thanks for reading
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Rough Literary Outline:
Raymond Peat
Danny Roddy
Georgi Dinkov
Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
William Blake
Trofim Lysenko
Christian Bohr
Hans Selye
Gilbert Ling -
Introductory biology, chemistry, and anatomy textbooks can be found here.
A lot might be unnecessary in them, so ideally someone would outline which chapters are essential to cover by someone with no education in these subjects.
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Interesting.
BTW Ray's idea wasn't only about WHAT to learn i.e. Biology, Chemistry, etc.
He was also big on HOW to learn i.e. philosophical aspects like ontology, epistemology, phenomenology, arts, etc.Panta rhei... | Liberté 🏴 | It depends... ;-)
A little Learning is a dangerous thing;
Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian Spring:
~Alexander Pope, An Essay on Criticism -
@zawisza
Thanks for sharing! I can't wait to have something more concrete and organized and this helps a lot. -
@Kvirion
Woah this something I definitely overlooked and equally important to the material itself, it would be useless without this. -
@The-New-Sun He's mentioned the Constance R. Martin textbook for endocrinology before as well, something to add to the list.
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It is difficult to read ASG without a basic physics and biology background, and impossible to read Ling without an extensive physics and maths one.
The basics should start with 1. physiology (Physiology, Costanzo; or Text-Book of Physiology, Bikov), 2. biochemistry (Lehninger 1st ed is good), and 3. organic chemistry (Organic chemistry with a biological emphasis). This sets foundational knowledge that is assumed in most of the books that influenced Ray.
A course on physics that covers classical physics, EM, basic QM, and an introduction to condensed matter is also necessary. I particularly like the three-volume Feynman lectures on Physics. They can probably be read in a year of appropriate effort.
Then endocrinology (Textbook of endocrinology, CR Martin), histology, and embryology in particular are necessary to understand the far-reaching implications of Ray's work. Ray was very fond of using examples from embryology.
This is the order that makes the most sense to me, but it can be tedious to put in so much time to master the fundamentals.
The particular text of choice for the subjects is mostly arbitrary so long as it is easy to read and didactic. I like older ones.
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@BioS dis guy doesnt know about wikipedia
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embryology is literally just that animals look like other animals as embroys lul
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@peatyourmeat embryology is useful for discerning the logical hierarchy of system in the body. In the embryo, things of more fundamental importance develop first. For instance, in vertebrates the thyroid gland is the first endocrine organ to develop and does so along with the gills, showing their interdependence for oxidative metabolism.
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Here's some texts that I've read and/or collected in relation to Peat, bioenergetics, and development.
This is not in order. I've put them into little thematic sections with links to downloadable content. I am not an expert on bioenergetics, this is just some of my personal efforts to better understand energy, development, health, and the rest. I do not agree with everything in these texts and reserve my own thoughts, blah blah blah.
Many of these are from a Ray Peat library website but some are my own readings and suggestions
Pre-study:
General Chemistry- Openstax has a good textbook for it.Nutrition: Nutrition and Physical Degeneration by Weston A Price.
Introductory sciences:
Cells, Gells, and the Engines of Life- PollackOrganic Chemistry- there are textbooks that are organic chemistry specifically for medical students or pre-health students. Libgen has one here.
Biochemistry- I would suggest Harper's Illustrated Biochemistry. Libgen has the most recent edition here. I've heard others recommend Biochemistry: A Short Course
Anatomy and Physiology- Pretty much anything, there's not much unique between editions save for the level of illustrations.
Physics- You can get textbooks that are intros to physics, specifically for health students
Living Rainbow: Water by Mae-Won Ho
Bioenergetic Sciences: These texts are introductions to bioenergetic science
This is a good introductory text to bioenergetics, these authors know their stuff about respiration. There's a section on mitochondria and medical illness towards the end of the book, it's worth it to just read through those.
Bioenergetics by Szent-Gyorgi
Rainbow and the Worm: A physics of Organisms by Mae-Won Ho
Bioenergetics and Bio-Energy: These texts are related to bioenergetics and the formation and impact of bioelectric fields and electromagnetic fields on biology.
The Physiology of Bioelectricity in Development, Tissue Regeneration and Cancer
Electromagnetics Fields in Biological Systems
Epidemiology of Electromagnetic Fields- this book is a look into various studies on the clinical effects of electromagnetic fields. Much of the data is epidemiological but the book also includes dose-control studies and other types of study. Definitely worth reading if you'd like to see a real "state of the literature" look into EMF and health, though it's about a decade out of date.
Bioelectronics by Szent-Gyorgi- it's a book by Szent-Gyorgi, it's obv about bioenergetics.
Biological effects of magnetic fields by Barnothy Vol.1 and Vol. 2
Hormones and Endocrine system: These texts relate to the endocrine system and hormones. This is introduction to thyroid function.
Textbook of Endocrine physiology(older)
Progestin vs Progesterone for heart health
Bioenergetics and development/evolution
Prenatal stress and development
Prenatal and Postnatal Development
Human nutrition
Digestion and Health- Cannon was one of Peat's favorite medical physiologists
Brain evolution and marine and freshwater foods- This is one of the Peatiest books I've ever read, not a sentence is wasted. I encourage everyone to give the authors a fair shake on how they discuss omega-3 and its roles. The authors discuss the evolution of the human diet and discuss multiple times the role of exogenous thyroid hormone consumption on the development of humans generation after generation This book showed me the widespread importance of coastal and freshwater ecosystems and foods for human development and makes me want to bash heads with heavy iron pans for how people treat the oceans, rivers, and seas.
Survival of the Fattest- written by one of the editors for the above-mentioned book. It goes into the evolution of human baby fat and how humans have evolved to have uniquely fatty babies. It's well-written.
Bioenergetics and Medicine
Clinical Autonomic and Mitochondrial Disorders
Mitochondria, drugs, and environmental toxicants
Mitochondria in Health and Disease
Physiology of Prenatal Exercise and Development
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Thank you very much for all the contributions @brad @JulofEnoch @BioS
This has helped immensely, thank you again.
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Sure thing.
I apologize that I do not have many book resources on endotoxin beyond what's available on libgen. I will say that those texts are technical but not very useful to Peating. I have a post in Literature review about branched-chain fatty acids which has a citation about omega-6 vs branched-chain(saturated) fatty acid endotoxins and how they are quite different in their impact on the body. There's some other good info in that post as well.
Idea- It might help to have part of your curriculum around specific claims or health ideas: "what is mitochondria?", "Immunity and fats", diet-heart theory, amyloid-alzheimer's theory, etc. You could make more specific reading suggestions and, more importantly, answer specific questions or concerns.
If you'd like, I have a readable and well-sourced book about saturated fat and cholesterol claims ala diet-heart theory. I ran into it around the same time I first heard about Peat, I apologize for not having added it to the list. I'd put it in a "Nutrition" or "Health myths" section. The author, Uffe Ravnskov, has a follow-up book though I admittedly haven't read the whole thing. He has a website, is 89 years old, and is still alive.
I like Ravnskov's first book because he goes through the actual cited proof and recommendations of the NIH 1984 "Consensus" conference on diet-heart theory which laid out the first "consensus" about cholesterol, saturated fats, and heart disease. Interestingly, they say that PUFA should be no more than 10% of energy, yet they don't say why. Ravnskov reveals why as that even PUFA advocates have known about the oxidative dangers of PUFA and the interaction between PUFA oxidation, cholesterol, and arterial plaque which really makes the heart disease relationship, not just cholesterol and plaque.
Ravnskov cites Scott Grundy(one of THE mainstream cholesterol medical researchers) who's quoted in the reference section that "intakes above 7% of total calories seemingly cannot be advocated with prudence". For the linked study, open the free pdf and keyword search "prudence," it comes right up. If you eat 2500 calories a day or less, that means at most 20 grams of PUFA.
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As an aside, if you're interested in physical chemistry-conceptual, rather than problem set work- and food, then I recommend checking out molecular gastronomy books. Molecular gastronomy is physical chemistry + food science. Protein denaturing, lipids, solvents, etc. are all physical chemistry. I have two recommendations written by Herve This- the founder of molecular gastronomy, a physical chemist.
Molecular Gastronomy: Exploring the Science of Flavor by Hervé This
This is his first book about molecular gastronomy to appear in English. He goes into the physiology of flavor and the chemistry of food. He gives a few recipes including a flourless microwave cake recipe I can personally attest to the quality and ease of. It's approachable and This is, without a doubt, French. He goes into great detail about champagne- something he later wrote an entire book about.
This is exactly what it says, a ~900 page handbook to molecular gastronomy. The book refers to physical chemistry articles you can check out for greater details. It's technical and thorough.
This has another book- Cooking: The Quintessential Art
French man discussing philosophy and life, a good bit rambling and a good bit thoughtful.
Cooking and eating are very Peaty activities, the most intimate way we interact with the world- taking it into us, making ourselves from it, over time replacing entire organs and tissues with the world and its contents.
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@sphenoid Holy fuck
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He's right. Thyroid forms within first month in humans alongside heart and lungs.
The brain doesn't develop a blood-brain barrier until the third trimester. Until then, the brain is a direct-to-blood endocrine organ. It begins actively secreting signaling molecules and regulating endocrine development from the first moments of brain cell existence.
Brain, thyroid, CO2, oxygen- Peaty areas of focus and the first embryo developments.
Greift nur hinein ins volle Menschenleben! Ein jeder lebt's, nicht vielen ist's bekannt, und wo ihr's packt, da ist's interessant.
Ray Peat first-ever interview(July 1987 on UofO Student Radio)
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@JulofEnoch Arising from the gills are the neck muscles and first respiratory muscles in humans, the sternocleidomastoid and trapezius. These are innervated by the accessory nerve which can be thought of as an extension of the vagus nerve since they share such a close relationship. The thyroid is also innervated by the vagus nerve, which controls blood supply to the organ, eventually determining its ability to produce and secrete its hormones. I think this is glossed over a lot in the Peat sphere but proper breathing --which requires activation of the SCM and trapezius-- is the gatekeeper to thyroid function. It also influences craniosacral rhythm as these muscles are some of the main drivers in skull motility.
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True, vagus nerve stimulation can increase the release of thyroid hormones and sympathovagal imbalance is linked with thyroid dysregulation.
Gatekeeper? I don't know, never did like the term's usage, too dramatic- that being said, the health impact of proper breathing and focused breathwork cannot be discredited and I wouldn't be surprised at a long-term effect of para/sympathetic breathwork on thyroid health,.
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@JulofEnoch Thank you very much for such detailed and insightful replies. I have been spending time writing and organizing a lot of the material.
As a beginner, I will be studying a major portion of the subjects before I can post anything. It's gonna take me a while, mainly because the aim is to have a full written document with all resources available, a concrete rubric for those interested to learn.
