Ray Peat HATED manganese
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Almost everything Ray Peat ever suggested doing to increase energy in regards to diet, was almost a guide on how to limit exposure to manganese:
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Grains, nuts and seeds are the highest sources of manganese.
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Fruits are in general lower in manganese than most other sources of carbs.
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He did not like bananas and pineapples. These don't have the problem that they are high in serotonin, it's that they are relatively higher in manganese in comparison to other fruits.
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The hypoxia response is a trigger for displacing manganese in the cell with iron. Living in higher altitude increases hypoxia and thus facilitates manganese detox.
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All dairy products, coca-cola, table sugar, orange juice are very low-manganese with dairy, table sugar and coca-cola practically having no manganese at all.
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The only grain product that Ray Peat liked was corn tortillas. Corn tortillas are the lowest manganese starch source, because of the nixtamalization.
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He liked potatoes. Peeled potatoes are the second lowest manganese source of starch.
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Mushrooms are very low in manganese, while a carrot a day is about 0.2 mg of manganese, so it still works on a low-manganese diet.
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In general most foods Ray Peat suggested are nutrient dense while also being low in manganese.
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Shortly before Ray Peat diet he started eating oatmeal, which is one of highest sources of manganese in common foods, perhaps undoing all of the manganese limiting he has done.
I have come to this conclusion while strictly limiting my manganese to about 1.5 mg per day by tracking my food intake on cronometer. Strict limitation of manganese produced almost the exact diet that Ray Peat was eating, without me even trying to eat like Ray Peat.
Limiting manganese to 1.5 mg has resolved all of my chronic health issues I had since childhood, with chronic copper deficiency (despite eating some beef liver everyday) resolving shortly after limiting manganese being the most data driven part of this improvement.
The central mechanism of manganese toxicity is producing a CoQ10 deficiency, which is the key molecule in the mitochondria, required for energy production. This mechanism is outlined in Chris Masterjohn's article: Manganese Toxicity Is a CoQ10 Deficiency
For me personally, Ubiquinol (CoQ10) was the only supplement that helped improve my health before I had started limiting manganese. After I limited manganese in my diet for about a month, I had an amazing surge of energy and euphoria. The ubiquinol, which I depended on for my health before, had started to make me overstimulated, rather than improving my health further, which I am sure was because my internal synthesis of CoQ10 had restored on this low-manganese diet. After this I stopped taking the ubiquinol and felt its effects without being overstimulated.
In this article Chris Masterjohn explains how common it is to have a manganese toxicity problem because of your genetics: Iron Overload: Forget What You Thought You Knew
As far as I know, Ray Peat has never mentioned limiting exposure to manganese, so I don't believe he was being deliberate in his manganese avoidance. I believe he was being vigilant about how different foods affect his health and came to this diet using his intuition naturally.
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alfredoolivas said:
Tidbits on manganese toxicity. I think anyone should be concerned on consuming large amounts of it, which is easy if you are a fellow autist that is prone to consuming stupid amounts of foods like pineapple or orange juice.
"In the rat, the half-lives of 16 brain regions are between 52 and 74 days [6]."`
"Mn concentrations in the cerebrospinal fluid, however, continued to increase even at the eight week. It is possible that a slow elimination of Mn from the cerebrospinal fluid may contribute to the high level of Mn in the brain "
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@kimarunas thank you for this detailed post. An interesting and unique take worth looking into
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@kimarunas hi, answering there too for other readers, and adding as i did read a bit more about it.
Ray peat never stated that he hate manganese, there is one statement associated to him saying commun diet probably has enough if i recall correctly.
nuts and seeds can Also be high in zinc, copper, molydenum, selenium, many elements that have balancing or antagonistic effects on manganese, i have never seen someone mentionning getting symptoms associated to excess manganese from nuts, i have not experienced it either even while consuming from 400g to a kilo of nuts most days for months/years, including macadamia.
Fruits it depend wich ones, going by average values, fruits such as grapes, pinnaple, raspberries, Blackberries, strawberries have good or high amount of manganese per weight, and even higher amount per carbs/calories compare to lot of foods, These fruits are communly consumed bu fruits eaters living in northern enough climates. Other communly consumed fruits such as apple, pears, watermelon, are much lower.
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