Creatine and Ray Peat
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@raypneat found this
https://youtu.be/495CtgExBXE?t=683seems like a slipper slope, he did mention in regards to large quantities but didn't specify what is large. Therefore I will not supplement creatine.
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I’ve heard of people getting better results from creatine while taking baking soda too so that might deal with the CO2 issue
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I take some creatine with my morning coffee.
I asked PeatBot about creatine.User: Is creatine healthy?
Peatbot: The context provided offers a nuanced view of creatine and its health implications. Here's a summary based on the information given:
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Neuroprotective Effects: Creatine has been shown to have neuroprotective properties in various models of neurodegeneration and aging. It appears to protect against excitotoxicity, oxidative stress, and disturbed cellular energy homeostasis, which are common aspects of neurodegenerative conditions and brain injury.
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Safety in Parkinson's Disease: A study involving aged patients with Parkinson's disease indicated that long-term creatine supplementation is safe. The main side effects noted were gastrointestinal complaints, and while serum creatinine levels increased (a normal consequence of creatine supplementation), other markers of kidney function remained normal.
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Cerebral Energetics: Creatine supplementation in humans has been shown to affect cerebral energetics, with an increase in the phosphocreatine/ATP ratio in the brain after a 7-day supplementation protocol. This suggests that creatine can influence high-energy phosphate turnover in the brain.
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Health and Longevity in Mice: In mouse models, creatine supplementation led to a higher median healthy lifespan and better performance in neurobehavioral tests. It also seemed to reduce oxidative stress and the accumulation of lipofuscin, an "aging pigment."
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Clinical Applications in Pediatrics: Creatine supplementation has been explored for various pediatric conditions, including creatine metabolism disorders, muscular dystrophies, and brain pathologies related to hypoxia and energy deficits. It has shown therapeutic benefits in some of these conditions.
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Diagnosis of Meningiomas: In the field of neuroradiology, the glutamate/creatine ratio in proton magnetic resonance spectroscopy has been used to help diagnose meningiomas, indicating that creatine levels can be a useful diagnostic marker.
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General Nutrition and Energy Metabolism: Creatine phosphate is an important energy reservoir for muscles, and ATP is involved in many life functions. The context suggests that fresh foods, which contain abundant ATP, are beneficial for nutrition.
However, it's important to note that while creatine has shown benefits in certain contexts, its effects can vary depending on the individual, their health status, and specific conditions. For example, while it has shown promise in mouse models and certain patient populations, the context mentions that the strong neuroprotective effects seen in animal studies have not been consistently reproduced in human clinical trials for neurodegenerative diseases.
In summary, creatine is generally considered safe and potentially beneficial for certain health conditions, particularly those involving energy metabolism and neuroprotection. However, its use should be tailored to individual needs and, ideally, done under medical supervision, especially in the case of specific health conditions or long-term supplementation.
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@raypneat I recall understanding him to say that it increases NO (please fact check) and that 5g per day is probably too high.
However, when answering he probably was thinking of it as person using it for the gym.
Cannot recall which podcast/ interview it was but I’ll post if I find it. -
@Buckian said in Creatine and Ray Peat:
@raypneat I recall understanding him to say that it increases NO (please fact check) and that 5g per day is probably too high.
However, when answering he probably was thinking of it as person using it for the gym.
Cannot recall which podcast/ interview it was but I’ll post if I find it.Just try it and see how you feel, no ?
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@Santosh this is an option. However, if the concern is overdosing further research and prudence may help.
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I keep seeing that creating leads to hair loss. Anyone else come across this?
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@Buckian My research indicates it's good for nerve damage and all you need is 5g a week which you can frontload like progesterone.
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@MasterPeatler thanks for sharing. This is much lower than the usual 5g per day!
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@Buckian said in Creatine and Ray Peat:
@Santosh this is an option. However, if the concern is overdosing further research and prudence may help.
Overdosing creatine ?
Just take 5g and go on about your day, I swear you guys are creating problems that don't even exist in the first place.
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@Santosh lol
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@Santosh lol. Touché.
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@Buckian said in Creatine and Ray Peat:
@Santosh lol. Touché.
Stop loling unless you also use pronouns to define yourself.
Keep a serious tone, work hard, have values, stop taking everything lightly, be rigorous. -
I'm with you.
Peat has made references to A Greek doctor and his clinical experiences on treating patients with urea and with creatine.
Urea used on wounds has antibacterial effects in that it cleans up decaying flesh in the wounds, thus depriving bacteria of food and in this way stops infections dead on its tracks. I use urea on my wounds and on my pet cats' wounds. Very very effective.
It has a similar kind of effect when ingested, as it goes to the liver and heals the liver. I've taken 30g/day for two weeks each time, and have seen my ALT and AST enzymes go down.
However, urea is deactivated past he liver and does little internally. And this is where creatine is used.
I would put 30g urea and 14g creatine in a liter of water and drink it throughout the day. At worst, the creatine would do nothing. As that has been my experience once.
But I plan on taking this shortly for two weeks, as I want to see the effect on my ataxia (or Parkinson's). My theory is that creatine would work like urea on the protein sediments or sludge on the blood vessels and clear them up. I can see this in the ESR going down if it works as I think it should.
With ESR going down, blood flow would also improve and the delivery of nutrients and oxygen to the brain would improve, and as a result my symptoms of ataxia would go away.
Temporal thinking is the faculty that’s
engaged by an enriched environment, but it’s
wrong to call it “thinking,” because it’s simply
the way organisms exist... - Ray Peat Nov 2017 Newsletter -
@yerrag said in Creatine and Ray Peat:
I'm with you.
Peat has made references to A Greek doctor and his clinical experiences on treating patients with urea and with creatine.
Urea used on wounds has antibacterial effects in that it cleans up decaying flesh in the wounds, thus depriving bacteria of food and in this way stops infections dead on its tracks. I use urea on my wounds and on my pet cats' wounds. Very very effective.
It has a similar kind of effect when ingested, as it goes to the liver and heals the liver. I've taken 30g/day for two weeks each time, and have seen my ALT and AST enzymes go down.
However, urea is deactivated past he liver and does little internally. And this is where creatine is used.
I would put 30g urea and 14g creatine in a liter of water and drink it throughout the day. At worst, the creatine would do nothing. As that has been my experience once.
But I plan on taking this shortly for two weeks, as I want to see the effect on my ataxia (or Parkinson's). My theory is that creatine would work like urea on the protein sediments or sludge on the blood vessels and clear them up. I can see this in the ESR going down if it works as I think it should.
With ESR going down, blood flow would also improve and the delivery of nutrients and oxygen to the brain would improve, and as a result my symptoms of ataxia would go away.
Don't use creatine if you are still drinking coffee, it will make you pee like a horse and wake you up multiple times at night.
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@Santosh easy there brother - you’re ganna hurt yourself.
You may notice that the original question in the post was about Dr Peat’s thoughts on creatine (not what current studies/conventional wisdom are for dosing creatine). My response was saying that I recall Dr Peat saying that a dose of 5g per day is too high but cannot recall the exact reasoning. Now the concern of ‘overdosing’ would be in light of this paraphrased Dr Peat statement - not because I think it’s a concern.
So if anything - I would say that I’ve taken this thread more seriously than you by actually answering the question at hand and not making assumptions about the users and their comments.
So as you say be rigorous.
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@Buckian said in Creatine and Ray Peat:
@Santosh easy there brother - you’re ganna hurt yourself.
You may notice that the original question in the post was about Dr Peat’s thoughts on creatine (not what current studies/conventional wisdom are for dosing creatine). My response was saying that I recall Dr Peat saying that a dose of 5g per day is too high but cannot recall the exact reasoning. Now the concern of ‘overdosing’ would be in light of this paraphrased Dr Peat statement - not because I think it’s a concern.
So if anything - I would say that I’ve taken this thread more seriously than you by actually answering the question at hand and not making assumptions about the users and their comments.
So as you say be rigorous.
I was refering to your "lol" which was useless.
Don't do useless things, it's annoying.And stop writing lengthy paragraphs, it's highly feminine. I can almost picture you beginning every sentence by "excuse me but" when talking in real life.
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@Santosh Thanks. I already pee a lot at night, and I wake up a lot because of it. So, I may cut back on the coffee once I get started on my urea/creatine intake.
My ESR got very high when I was having bronchitis. My red blood cells and hemoglobin went down as well. I suspect many red blood cells died as a result (hemolysis). After my bronchitis was fixed and my lungs restored to full breathing, the red blood cells that died are slowly being cleared by the system in the backed up lymph nodes (as evident in a swollen elbow lymph node) as well as my ESR being high (from 54 to 31 e 3 months ago to the current 14).
I suspect in order to clear the RBCs , a lot of waste has to be excreted and a lot of this waste is being phagocytized and being released as feces, urine, and even phlegm.
Which is why the current high urination rate and volume is occurring with a lot of foaming, and why when I am lying down, a lot of white or clear foamy phlegm is coming out. Normally, this isn't so evident but the amount of waste being cleared can't be handles by the liver and gallbladder alone, which excretes via the fecal route. Even then, my stools has been unusually loose and this strengthens my theory.
I am monitoring my ESR to see if I can go back to my normal state 5 years ago, where my ESR was a perfect zero.
I hope taking creatine would speed up the clearing of sludge in my vessels.
Tying loose ends and connecting the dots, and based on my own experience (what can I say- it can be faulted for just being my n=1), I'm learning a lot about what causes my bp to be high and how I can naturally lower it (a work in progress but seeing the light at the end of the tunnel).
Also, getting similarly developed first person-based experiential insights into why I developed Parkinson's and how I can make it go away. I think taking thiamine helps, but I think that a lot more has to do with the inability to deliver enough nutrients and oxygen into my brain- the nerve center- because the microcirculation (capillaries) are obstructed by sludge. Metabolism in the brain down regulated to anaerobic glycolysis from efficient mitochondrial respiration due to lack of enough oxygen being supplied.
Clearing the sludge to get the oxygen supply back is important, and I hope creatine can help with that.
@mostlylurking I think (I have not been reading a lot lately so I could be wrong) that anaerobic glycolysis is wasteful of thiamine, and that thiamine mega dosing helps, but clearing the capillaries of obstruction to make oxygen available to the brain fully is the way to fixing Parkinson's. Thiamine megadosing helps by compensating for the inefficiency and wastefulness of anaerobic glycolysis.
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@yerrag said in Creatine and Ray Peat:
@mostlylurking I think (I have not been reading a lot lately so I could be wrong) that anaerobic glycolysis is wasteful of thiamine, and that thiamine mega dosing helps, but clearing the capillaries of obstruction to make oxygen available to the brain fully is the way to fixing Parkinson's. Thiamine megadosing helps by compensating for the inefficiency and wastefulness of anaerobic glycolysis.
Hi yerrag, thanks for the link; I always value your insight. I read through your post and immediately thought of a Ray Peat audio when he discusses vitamin K2 for removing calcium in the circulatory system.
I believe my own thiamine deficiency/functional blockage fall of 2020 derailed my calcium storage which usually means the calcium that is supposed to get stored in the bones gets stored in the soft tissue (including the blood vessels) instead. Peat related a story about a doctor he knew that used high dose K2 (40-50mgs?) to resolve his hypertension.
Thiamine is needed for good oxidative metabolism. When it is deficient, the end product of the process is lactic acid instead of carbon dioxide. If things are working right, the carbon dioxide drags the calcium inside the cell out when the carbon dioxide exits the cell (from memory - A Peat explanation from somewhere). So it makes sense that calcium storage would get derailed in a thiamine deficiency.
Here's a link or two:
https://bioenergetic.life/?q=k2
The one with the story about the doctor high dosing the K is in there somewhere....
also this:https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7926526/Please note that vitamin D, needed for the immune system to work, also is responsible for making calcium get stored in the bones; in order to do this, there needs to be vitamin K available. So I think both D and K would be helpful.
