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Girlfriend going off Hormonal Birth Control and Anti-Depressants for First Time in Half a Decade. Any Advice for Her.

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  • S
    SpicyPeater
    last edited by Jun 3, 2024, 3:24 AM

    Girlfriend going off Hormonal Birth Control and Anti-Depressants for First Time in Half a Decade. Any Advice for Her.

    Any advice for her cold turkeying hormonal birth control and then anti-depressants. She wants to replace it with supplements / less chemically aggressive nutrients.

    Any advice helps. Mucho appreciado.

    S 1 Reply Last reply Jun 3, 2024, 3:46 AM Reply Quote 0
    • S
      SpicyPeater @SpicyPeater
      last edited by Jun 3, 2024, 3:46 AM

      @SpicyPeater
      have already been told:

      • vitamin a for acne

      • sugars (fruits), carbs, and potatoes

      • 100 grams of protein a day

      • oyster for copper and zinc

      • liver for iron, zinc, etc.

      • sunlight,

      • smaller meals more frequently

      P 1 Reply Last reply Jun 3, 2024, 3:33 PM Reply Quote 0
      • S
        Sunniva
        last edited by Jun 3, 2024, 8:48 AM

        DO NOT cold turkey the anti depressant. You want to wean off low and slow. This should take many months. There is some good info in this article, but the suggestion it could be done in 6 weeks is not correct.
        https://www.health.harvard.edu/diseases-and-conditions/going-off-antidepressants

        "You're changing your past every time you learn something because you become a different organism" Ray Peat

        "Everything is changing thru time, whether it's a word, organism, thing. The world around it changes, and so its relationships change"Ray Peat

        P 1 Reply Last reply Jun 3, 2024, 3:41 PM Reply Quote 0
        • S
          Sunniva
          last edited by Jun 3, 2024, 8:56 AM

          Ray Peats email response to getting off antidepressant use.

          [Weaning off anti-depressants] Keeping the metabolic rate and cholesterol up is important, so that repair and adaptation will be quick. Progesterone reduces pain and anxiety, and pregnenolone would be the most convenient supplement for men, but it's hard to find products without allergens. Combining progesterone and DHEA or testosterone can produce the stabilizing effect without suppressing the libido. Benadryl and cyproheptadine are probably both helpful. Withdrawal from morphine and SSRIs and migraine involve some similar processes.

          I knew someone who had been addicted to morphine and alcohol for 30 years, who was drinking quarts of beer and wine daily when he didn't have morphine, who had an opportunity for a good job if he could get sober. Starting progesterone at bedtime (and stopping the wine), he said it was the first time he didn't have a hangover in the morning. He used enough progesterone to neuter most people, but said it didn't affect his sex function; he was taking a lot of Cytomel and magnesium, but wasn't drunk again as long as I knew him, and his general health improved.

          It depends on how much pregnenolone you can assimilate. People would use progesterone in amounts needed to stop the withdrawal symptoms, but pregnenolone doesn't have the powerful effects of progesterone, even in multi-gram quantities, so it's just a matter of seeing what it can do. As I understand the mechanism (migraine, withdrawal, etc.), estrogen-histamine-serotonin rise on a background of hypothyroid liver malfunction, cytomel (and/or sugar, selenium, B vitamins) allows the liver and other detoxifying systems to lower them, and the lower they are, the less progesterone or pregnenolone it takes to block the symptoms.

          "You're changing your past every time you learn something because you become a different organism" Ray Peat

          "Everything is changing thru time, whether it's a word, organism, thing. The world around it changes, and so its relationships change"Ray Peat

          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • S
            Sunniva
            last edited by Jun 3, 2024, 9:14 AM

            https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/

            "You're changing your past every time you learn something because you become a different organism" Ray Peat

            "Everything is changing thru time, whether it's a word, organism, thing. The world around it changes, and so its relationships change"Ray Peat

            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • S
              Sunniva
              last edited by Jun 3, 2024, 9:16 AM

              http://haidut.me/?p=891

              "You're changing your past every time you learn something because you become a different organism" Ray Peat

              "Everything is changing thru time, whether it's a word, organism, thing. The world around it changes, and so its relationships change"Ray Peat

              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
              • S
                Sunniva
                last edited by Sunniva Jun 3, 2024, 1:26 PM Jun 3, 2024, 9:27 AM

                Read Ray Peats articles on serotonin.
                Ssri increase serotonin.

                HAIDUT has recommended cyproheptadine to help get off ssri

                Comment from another site:
                "Note to others; I received several PMs who found cyproheptadine very useful after discontinuing SSRIs. "

                "You're changing your past every time you learn something because you become a different organism" Ray Peat

                "Everything is changing thru time, whether it's a word, organism, thing. The world around it changes, and so its relationships change"Ray Peat

                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • B
                  BroJonas
                  last edited by Jun 3, 2024, 2:44 PM

                  If the nutritional foundation is good I would add in Progest e during luteal phase to make up for all the years progesterone production lost

                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • P
                    PeatPioneer @SpicyPeater
                    last edited by Jun 3, 2024, 3:33 PM

                    @SpicyPeater do you know a good vitamin A supplement in the UK

                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • P
                      PunkinEater @Sunniva
                      last edited by PunkinEater Jun 3, 2024, 3:43 PM Jun 3, 2024, 3:41 PM

                      @Sunniva

                      Can confirm. It took me about 6 years to quit long term Effexor use. What I've gathered from years of reading accounts is that a few lucky people seem to be able to quit easily, some have a rough few weeks and most have years long protracted withdrawal.

                      Everyone wants to believe they are in group one or two, so nothing I say here is most likely going to influence your decision to taper quickly. Just know that if she starts to get severe psychological symptoms of depression, hopelessness and terror, it's probably withdrawals. At that point the best option is to reinstate the AD, then plan to taper at a rate of 10% per month.

                      S 1 Reply Last reply Jun 3, 2024, 4:00 PM Reply Quote 0
                      • S
                        Sunniva @PunkinEater
                        last edited by Sunniva Jun 4, 2024, 3:08 AM Jun 3, 2024, 4:00 PM

                        @PunkinEater, yes, I took the same ssri and weaned off in about a year. I started by cutting the pill in quarters. I would take 3 of the quarters, and then half of the last quarter. I would go at least a month on that reduced dose, and then take off a little more. It went pretty good, considering the drug that I was getting off of.

                        I wish I had the Ray peat advice at the time I did it to take some progest-e.

                        My advice is don't rush it.

                        "You're changing your past every time you learn something because you become a different organism" Ray Peat

                        "Everything is changing thru time, whether it's a word, organism, thing. The world around it changes, and so its relationships change"Ray Peat

                        P 1 Reply Last reply Jun 3, 2024, 4:05 PM Reply Quote 0
                        • S
                          Sunniva
                          last edited by Sunniva Jun 4, 2024, 3:05 AM Jun 3, 2024, 4:03 PM

                          Since she ended up on an ssri, you might find some good info on Haidut page for ssri topics

                          http://haidut.me/?s=Ssri

                          "You're changing your past every time you learn something because you become a different organism" Ray Peat

                          "Everything is changing thru time, whether it's a word, organism, thing. The world around it changes, and so its relationships change"Ray Peat

                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • S
                            Sunniva
                            last edited by Sunniva Jun 4, 2024, 3:05 AM Jun 3, 2024, 4:05 PM

                            As far as birth control, I went on and off them several times without any perceived problem.

                            Everyone might be different.

                            Knowing what I know now, I would never take them. I advise any young woman not to take them.

                            As stated above, I would get some progest-e and take it in a cyclic rhythm in line with the cycle.

                            "You're changing your past every time you learn something because you become a different organism" Ray Peat

                            "Everything is changing thru time, whether it's a word, organism, thing. The world around it changes, and so its relationships change"Ray Peat

                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • P
                              PunkinEater @Sunniva
                              last edited by Jun 3, 2024, 4:05 PM

                              @Sunniva Hi Fren!

                              At first I cut over three months and everything went fine. About a month after my last dose I went completely nuts with non-stop panic/terror/horror attacks. That lasted a few months until I reinstated a partial dose. From there I cut 10% per month which took a few years.

                              I can't say the progestE really does anything for me. The only thing that seems to help is diphenhydramine. I still have trouble sleeping through the night, but it's not too bad. I also get claustrophobic attacks from time to time.

                              S 1 Reply Last reply Jun 17, 2024, 7:17 PM Reply Quote 0
                              • S
                                saturnuscv
                                last edited by Jun 17, 2024, 7:16 PM

                                Low doses of Cyproheptadine. (Work your way up from .5 to 2mg /night)

                                Progest-E

                                Thiamine (recommend benfothiamine)

                                Egg Yolks

                                Cook with coconut oil

                                Fresh fruit

                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • S
                                  saturnuscv @PunkinEater
                                  last edited by Jun 17, 2024, 7:17 PM

                                  @PunkinEater drop diphenhydramine for Cyproheptadine. Less side effects and better for fixing serotonin system dysfunction.

                                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                  • ?
                                    A Former User
                                    last edited by Jun 17, 2024, 9:14 PM

                                    Hopefully your relationship survives her coming off BC, I’ve heard many horror stories.

                                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
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