Holy Basil: Phyto-TESTOSTERONE, Progesterone and thyro-mimetic ?

[lobotomize-me]

@Mauritio but wouldnt me being/feeling as if i am a sheep in a cage indicate that i have too much cortisol/stress?

Plus i just realised the active compound in basil is rosmarinic acid which i saw you mentikned in another thread is Immunosuppressive

[Mauritio]

@lobotomize-me yeah it would . But maybe it's from something else.

Why is rosmarinic acid the main active component ?

[Kvirion]

Just a field report...
I tried Holy Basil today. I didn't notice much effect.
Probably, some anti-inflammatory (maybe TSH lowering one?) and a bit cortisol/adrenaline lowering one, but since I have my cortisol pretty under control this wasn't any significant change.
No change in body temperature or libido.

[Mauritio]

@Kvirion thanks for sharing. Maybe sweet basil will work better.

[Kvirion]

@Mauritio said in Holy Basil: Phyto-TESTOSTERONE, Progesterone and thyro-mimetic ?:

sweet basil

Sweet basil seems to be a galactagogue, i.e., it promotes lactation in humans and other animals, i.e., increases prolactin—therefore, I wouldn't touch it with a proverbial stick.

[lobotomize-me]

@Mauritio any assumptions which other Moa it may use to increase testosterone?

[lobotomize-me]

@Mauritio A study screening Thai plants for 5α-reductase inhibitory activity found that Ocimum basilicum had a finasteride equivalent activity (FEA) value of 63.12 ± 0.57, indicating significant inhibition compared to other plants like Centella asiatica (32.00 ± 0.91)
Opinions?

[Mauritio]

@Kvirion do you have any reference for it increasing prolactin in vivo ?
Some of the studies I posted above used sweet basil and it drastically increased testosterone which is unlikely if it increases prolactin...

[Mauritio]

@lobotomize-me i wouldn't care too much about in vitro studies . But if you send the link I'll take a look at it.

[lobotomize-me]

@Mauritio http://pejouhesh.sbmu.ac.ir/article-1-2084-en.html https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9210833/

[lobotomize-me]

@Mauritio https://www.researchgate.net/publication/228750879_Screening_of_steroid_5a-reductase_inhibitory_activity_and_total_phenolic_content_of_Thai_plants Quick tip: If you're on a PC using Chrome, right click and select Search with Google Lens. Then highlight the text, and it will easily help you find the sources

[Kvirion]

@Mauritio said in Holy Basil: Phyto-TESTOSTERONE, Progesterone and thyro-mimetic ?:

@Kvirion do you have any reference for it increasing prolactin in vivo ?

Sweeti basil is a galactagogue and galactagogues increase prolactin...

Some of the studies I posted above used sweet basil and it drastically increased testosterone which is unlikely if it increases prolactin...

Maybe an increase in progesterone overcomes prolactin, or maybe the antiinflammatory actions of basil help with the production of testosterone.

This is too complicated and unreliable mode of action for me. Therefore not worth trying - at least for me..

[Mauritio]

@lobotomize-me Like I said in-vitro . But still worrying. So definitely something to keep in mind.

[Mauritio]

@Kvirion you do you . For me it certainly didn't feel like it raised prolactin , quite the opposite.

[lobotomize-me]

@Mauritio yep

[Kvirion]

@Mauritio said in Holy Basil: Phyto-TESTOSTERONE, Progesterone and thyro-mimetic ?:

@Kvirion you do you . For me it certainly didn't feel like it raised prolactin , quite the opposite.

Yep, right. Context matters
Therefore Perceive. Think. Act. is a bit different for everyone.

[Mauritio]

@lobotomize-me saw you also posted some prolactin studies ... I'm always a bit cautious when they're in a very (gender) specific context, like pregnancy or PCOS they often have weird results. And some amounts of estrogen and prolactin are needed for pregnancies , that's probably why you can induce abortions with bromocriptine.

[lobotomize-me]

@Mauritio @Kvirion I’ve looked a bit more into which compounds may be responsible for DHT inhibition in basil, and I found that it’s probably linalool and/or 1,8-cineole. Some ways to reduce these compounds are:

1. Drying the basil at 40°C – This can reduce linalool content by up to 59%, according to studies.

2. Hot water infusion – Both linalool and 1,8-cineole are oils and therefore hydrophobic, meaning they tend to remain in the leaves. Meanwhile, water-soluble compounds like rosmarinic acid dissolve into the infusion.

3. Use Ocimum basilicum var. purpureum – This variety contains only up to 0.2% linalool and no significant presence of 1,8-cineole. Instead, methyl chavicol dominates, making up about 57.3%.

4. Add baking soda to the solution – This can make the phytoestrogens in basil less stable

[Kvirion]

@lobotomize-me Nice find, thanks!
So, some next experiments before me...

[cs3000]

@lobotomize-me thanks , so where it could increase T3 u expect to see more steroids, but the Test increase could be also somewhat from lower conversion to dht by the looks of it then when using certain extracts, from things in ethanol fraction
i dont think its functionally estrogenic by default because the cortisol also dropped a lot in the OP male lamb study. looks to be sex dependant because of stimulating hormone production at gonads? as the lambs shouldnt have had lower cortisol and higher test if it was estrogenic to them right

but theres a lot of mixed results with it maybe because of the extracts

(broadly most studies only give insight on test increase instead of dht, not always insight alone into if net androgenic i guess. e.g
finasteride can raise test a little where its lowering conversion to dht. though it lowers DHT 50% and only gives like a 10% test increase with that drop. so much of a big Test increase wouldnt be the decreased conversion going by that)

if the oils are mostly responsible for downsides u only get low amounts of essential oils when just ingesting the leaves instead of concentrated extract (gotta be powdered unless chewing for humans to break through the cellulose. or doing hot water infusion like u mentioned) https://iwaponline.com/aqua/article/70/5/773/82378/Essential-oil-and-linalool-contents-in-basil
like 0.5% oil and only 5% of that as linalool, of dry leaves, so 5mg total oils per gram

probably why the studies giving them just the leaves showed good results,
not pushing the oil so much?

, the Jumbo 4320 Thai basils water extract showed the highest total phenolic content at the value of 459.62 ± 3.07 mg gallic acid equivalent/100 g

follow by ethanol and ethyl acetate extracts at 179.80 ± 0.55 and 56.95 ± 0.99 mg GAE/100 g, respectively.1

using water only extract showed a nice effect on diabetes. but high amount (17.5% of dried water extract compared to dry powder weight so 6x dose) https://scialert.net/fulltext/?doi=pjbs.2020.1010.1017

@cs3000 said in Holy Basil: Phyto-TESTOSTERONE, Progesterone and thyro-mimetic ?:

But this one, using very high dose of 80% ethanol : 20% water extract, raised testosterone without crashing LH or causing infertility
https://academicjournals.org/article/article1380729420_Khaki et al.pdf from leaves bought in iran. the rabbit study was india

300mg/kg dose of just the oil extract caused infertility and lowered testosterone , 100mg/kg didnt raise or lower testosterone https://dergipark.org.tr/en/pub/jabs/issue/34910/387191
so its probably the water soluble compounds responsible , or leaves from certain locations