Thyroid Log
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Spoke 2 soon. Had 2 bad days in a row.
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@GreekDemiGod said in Thyroid Log:
Had 2 bad days in a row.
By bad days you mean worse than before taking thyroid?
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@DonkeyDude yes. Suddenly felt very hypo. Either it’s the liver that I ate having an anti-thyroid effect through Vitamin A, or the T4 I’m taking has accumulated and converting to rt3. I’ve had this happen before.
It’s frustrating cause I’m taking a quite low dose of T4. 25 mcg. How much lower should I go? I should take it more sparingly perhaps. -
@GreekDemiGod What is your vitamin D and calcium consumption like? Eating Vitamin A rich foods without adequate vitamin D can do some weird shit. I noticed this myself. I think it can stimulate PTH whenever there's a D deficiency. I don't know that for sure, but all three A, D, & calcium play integrated roles with one another. For me, when I notice my temps drop, usually it has something to do with PTH.
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3 weeks on thyroid
Switched to 50mcg T4 and 12.5 mcg T3. Currently feeling great. Quality of life substantially improved.
I went to the endo last week, she said that my blood tests are fine and I do t have any problems with my thyroid.
But how can that be possible when I tick all the symptoms of hypothyroidism and see improvements with taking exogenous thyroid hormone? -
@GreekDemiGod If you tick all boxes for hypothyroidism then what symptoms were drastically improved?
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Increase in energy closer to normal levels and reduction of brain fog.
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@GreekDemiGod Cause docs work under a different paradigm/ideology. Looking at the wrong things. fixing numbers on a page is their goal
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@GreekDemiGod Thyroid tests from docs are usually bunk. You can exhibit hypothyroid symptoms and ur numbers for what they test be in the “normal range”…and that range is determined usually by the average number of people who get their thyroid tested… and those, if not most, tend to be hypothyroid given that most of us have suboptimal health lol
erm...[insert brainrot quote]
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Increased my T4 from from 50 mcg to 62.5 mcg. I take it first thing in the morning on an empty stomach and 1 hr before food for maximum absorption.
I've also reduced my T3 intake to under 10 mcg/ day. The plan is to transition to T4 monotherapy. -
Update:
Now doing 75 mcg T4 and nibbling T3 (< 12 mcg total).
I increased because for some reason, my TSH went back up, from 1.84 to 3.26. -
@GreekDemiGod beginner here. what’s the issue with low SHBG? wouldn’t that mean higher free test? would mean more free e2 as well of course but lowering shbg wouldn’t even change the free test:free estrogen ratio since they would both become lower equally surely
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@hypercashoidism It’s below the lower limit, that’s too low. last time I tested, my SHBG was 12.
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Starting to realize that I have conversion issues. On T4 alone, I feel awful, very fatigued. On T4 + T3 nibbles, much better, I'm able to function.
I've also been reading on why T3 monotherapy is not sustainable and doesn't work in most. When you take T3 only, it will suppress your TSH, causing your thyroid to produce much less T4 naturally. That's why you need to add T4 in the right amounts. Too less exogenous T4 will leave you with your thyroid production suppressed and at the same time, the exogenous amount will not be enough.
I also don't agree with Ray and Danny Roddy saying that Calcium and Iron, and food in general, doesn't interfere with thyroid absorption %. Because I've been reading how people who were on T4 monotherapy and eating within 1hr of taking the medication saw much better results when they ate 4hrs after taking the medication. So they either took it at night 3-4 hrs after last meal, or very early in the morning, 4-6AM. -
Switched to 100mcg T4 and 12 - 25 mcg T3 after latest blood tests.
TSH went down to 1.16.
FT3 in the middle of the range
FT4 dropped to 13.5.Judging from the blood tests, it looks like:
- both exogenous T3 and T4 suppress TSH
- exogenous T3 also suppresses (or lowers, depending on the dose) the body's natural production of T4, because the body senses more active thyroid hormone, so it downregulates natural production of T4. This is thy T3 monotherapy doesn't work long-term.
- To compensate for the FT4 drop due to exogenous T3, we have to supply a generous dose of T4
I’ve been feeling better and better. Fatigue has been diminishing.
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Current dosages:
- 100 mcg T4
- 12-20 mcg T4 (it varies on a day by day basis). The goal is to eventually wean off T3 and be on T4 only.
For the past 3 days, I have set an alarm at 5am to take my thyroid meds. This is to allow 4 hrs between the meds and the first meal of the day. I'm doing this to get maximum absorption from the meds. I'm aware that this is not what Peat advised, and it's more in line with mainstream advice about T4 dosing, but I'm willing to experiment.
Since taking my dose at 5AM, my temps have been consistently high. Pulse is decent too. Not consistently high, though.
Overall, I feel slightly better with my energy levels, but other symptoms are still present for the time being.
When my pulse and temps are both high (higher than 37.0 C, and pulse over 80), I feel slightly euphoric. -
Quick update
Daytime temps are good, I often reach 36.8 - 37 C. Nighttime temps are lower from what I noticed, they go as low as 36.0 or 35.8, even in the summertime.
I haven't been feeling that great on 125 mcg T4 (+ added T3). I think the T4 is making me feel emotionally flat, numb. Libido and vitality hasn't improved.
I might switch things up and lower my T4 intake.Blood tests look good, TSH between 1 and 1.5 on this amount of T4, FT4 mid-normal range, FT3 mid-high range.
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Reduced my T4 dosage and already feeling a difference within less than 2 days. I woke up in a better mood and more fresh this morning.
It’s clear that all that T4 was partially converting to rT3. -
@GreekDemiGod said in Thyroid Log:
Reduced my T4 dosage and already feeling a difference within less than 2 days. I woke up in a better mood and more fresh this morning.
It’s clear that all that T4 was partially converting to rT3.Keep in mind selenium is very important for T4's conversion to T3. A relatively sterile small intestine is important too, as endotoxin blocks that conversion.
Danny had the opinion that people with poor liver function (likely from endotoxin) respond better to less T4. Like a 2:1 or even 1:1 ratio of T4 to T3. There's probably some truth to this.
But I get the impression a lot of people believe it's best to just role with those ratios forever, lol. Taking T3 and T4 in even ratios can be a get-by, but it's not really a permanent solution. It's best to fix whatever is wrong the liver. Which isn't so easy, and usually require rigorous experimentation with diet. Namely removing any and all problematic foods (grains, legumes, nightshades, FODMAPS, etc.). Even fruits with a really high fructose:glucose ratio can be problematic for some people.
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L LucH referenced this topic on
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What is your copper status? Have you tested ceruloplasmin?
If you're low in copper, that could affect your thyroid Rsy Peat, Generative Energy).
I did an experiment, and began to incorporate a fermented crustacean sauce (common to Southeasr Asians) to my intake of cooked greens. After a year, my ceruloplasmin went from low of range, at 22, to high of range at 38.
Ray recommends eating shrimp, but I didn't like the idea of eating something that's farm-raised with plenty of antibiotic, and I figure crustaceans would be a good substitute.
Red light therapy would be useful to ensure the copper gets to increase your cytochrome oxidase needed in the ETC in mitochondrial respiration.
Since no one really knows the right amount to supplement copper, it is better to eat copper-rich foods, and I would recommend you to do so. The caveat is you may need to acquire a taste for the fermented crustacean, something you have to overcome. Otherwise, the fermented crustacean sauce is affordable and easily bought at Asian grocery stores. In Filipino groceries, it is called bagoong.
Temporal thinking is the faculty that’s
engaged by an enriched environment, but it’s
wrong to call it “thinking,” because it’s simply
the way organisms exist... - Ray Peat Nov 2017 Newsletter
