Beware of the Low Vitamin A Zealots- New Thorough Video by Mike Fave
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@dan-dominic Excellent video!! Worth the time.
Thx!! -
Those degenerates are pretty upset about Mike's video getting some attention. Charlie is already doing overtime throwing suitable insults at Mike, and making up random statements of Peaters how they supposedly destroyed their health, teeth, what will you. You can picture him shaking his can of beans in anger as he realizes that participation on his forum is at an all time low, and all but the most retarded customers are slowly disappearing.
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@Kvothe said in Beware of the Low Vitamin A Zealots- New Thorough Video by Mike Fave:
Those degenerates are pretty upset about Mike's video getting some attention. Charlie is already doing overtime throwing suitable insults at Mike, and making up random statements of Peaters how they supposedly destroyed their health, teeth, what will you. You can picture him shaking his can of beans in anger as he realizes that participation on his forum is at an all time low, and all but the most retarded customers are slowly disappearing.
Seriously, and then mister holy Lion will say that he is a christian, while being so hateful. The man has no sense of guilt.
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Never a dull moment. Mike dissects the subject well and he did his research as objectively as he could. I'm glad he did this as I admit I'm lost in refuting the idea of Vitamin A being a toxin in the way other vitamins are not outside of overdosing.
I am biased towards Ray Peat's view on Vitamin A as I had without question embraced his suggestion of eating a serving of liver once a week and practiced this lifestyle with no specific goal in mind but to improve my general health. But surprised to find that after 5 years on it, my eyesight improved gradually to the point where I had a recent eye exam as part of renewing my driver's license that I realized I am officially not required to wear glasses to drive. At my age, I should be wearing bifocals as I was nearsighted since my high school days and as I got older my ability to read small type became impaired as well.
Until I got the retinol from following Ray's suggestion. I would even go as far as saying that the beta-carotene can't hold a candle to what the retinol in beef liver does to sharpen my eyesight.
I say this because there are some things that involve time that can't be sped up. Growing up from an infant to an adult, making fine wine, the setting and curing of masonry - these are just a few of the examples that many in bioenergetics fail to appreciate when they would reflexively look for a shorter way to get things to improve in their physiology.
My eyesight improved over 5 years, so did my metabolism as I went cold turkey on PUFA and at least 4 years went by before I tested myself to find that I was no longer hypoglycemic, a transformation that is part of my body gradually losing its PUFA stores, which made my body absorb and metabolize blood sugar more readily and efficiently (thru utilizing mitochondrial respiration). It was a slow transformation that is more gentle as the body didn't have to be subjected to sudden changes in shifting its the mix in its metabolic pathways in creating energy. The end result is expressed as better blood sugar regulation (sugar spikes mean nothing to me at all as I coyld easily absorb sudden huge sugar intakes like a healthy river drains a sudden flash storm) and in good, if not optimal acid-base balance (due to the abundance of CO2 produced from oxidative respiration, which is well used by the body as a pH buffer).
I only say this because Mike seems to be saying that Ray Peat saying it takes as long as 4 years to get rid of PUFA stores from the time PUFA intake is stopped - shouldn't be taken seriously. I want to say that Ray isn't wrong at all, and my testimonial backs Ray's idea on this.
I know this isn't a popular position, but it is what it is. Most people would rather find a ahorter time frame, and I dont blame them. Perhaps Mike has a way, as haidut has been talking about the combo of using aspirin and niacinamide while being on cold turkey from PUFA for years now.
And haidut hasn't really slimmed down a bit. Neither have the members in RPF during the years I've been with RPF.Contrary to the delusional claim of @Truth that I wasn't successful in achieving optimal metabolism, I have achieved that already long ago. And it is by following Ray Peat. Certainly it is hard for health coaches to sell their clients on the idea that 4 years is needed to really get rid of PUFA stores, but the reality may be that. Unless otherwise proven.
As sure as the sun rises and sets, people who can't accept the long time it takes to get rid of PUFA stores in order to live a healthy lifestyle that relies on sugar metabolusm primarily- they would have to embrace the false nutritional lifestyles centered on keto and carnivore. But for their lack of the patience of a turtle, they won't have the kind of health that comes from being less stressed, as their body would have to rely on adaptations that necessitate the production of stress hormones to keep their body in survival mode. On vicious cycles instead of virtuous cycles. One is low energy and shorter lived. The other high energy and longer lived.
Temporal thinking is the faculty that’s
engaged by an enriched environment, but it’s
wrong to call it “thinking,” because it’s simply
the way organisms exist... - Ray Peat Nov 2017 Newsletter -
Good content
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@yerrag said in Beware of the Low Vitamin A Zealots- New Thorough Video by Mike Fave:
Contrary to the delusional claim of @Truth that I wasn't successful in achieving optimal metabolism, I have achieved that already long ago. And it is by following Ray Peat. Certainly it is hard for health coaches to sell their clients on the idea that 4 years is needed to really get rid of PUFA stores, but the reality may be that. Unless otherwise proven.
As sure as the sun rises and sets, people who can't accept the long time it takes to get rid of PUFA stores in order to live a healthy lifestyle that relies on sugar metabolusm primarily- they would have to embrace the false nutritional lifestyles centered on keto and carnivore. But for their lack of the patience of a turtle, they won't have the kind of health that comes from being less stressed, as their body would have to rely on adaptations that necessitate the production of stress hormones to keep their body in survival mode. On vicious cycles instead of virtuous cycles. One is low energy and shorter lived. The other high energy and longer lived.
It's better to keep your confused comments on the other post, you clearly said weeks ago that the practical application of an "optimal sugar metabolism" is what's missing from Raymond Peat's ideas, and didn't answer when I asked if you reached it practically, and now you claim you reached it through Ray Peat's ideas, no sense.
That's what you said weeks ago, either you're confused, or you're lying, or you don't know how to express your ideas:
@yerrag said in Banned from RP forum : Can you do better than this.:
RPF, as I said in previous a previous, has been a failure. Its main pillar is that optimal sugar metabolism is the key to health. Yet the site is vexed and stuck in not knowing how to make its members transform themselves from being poor sugar metabolizers into optimal sugar metabolizers. Ray Peat spoke only about the superiority of having optimal sugar metabolism, bit never spoke how to go about making that transformation. The site could have provided that a workable blueprint on how to go about that transformation, thus enabling many members towards the path to metabolic health. But it never got that going. There was a member named Cirion. He was piling on weight taking in lots of sugar because he believed sugar was good, but his body did not metabolize sugar well, and so he suddenly dropped out never to be heard from again. We don't really know if is still alive.
I feel charlie would be better off refocusing the website towards making the transformation to optimal sugar metabolism be a key goal before he embarked on his anti-peat mission
Thrive for the highest degree of energy
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DanDare looks to be a new alt account
I have my reasons…..
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@Truth said in Beware of the Low Vitamin A Zealots- New Thorough Video by Mike Fave:
@yerrag said in Beware of the Low Vitamin A Zealots- New Thorough Video by Mike Fave:
Contrary to the delusional claim of @Truth that I wasn't successful in achieving optimal metabolism, I have achieved that already long ago. And it is by following Ray Peat. Certainly it is hard for health coaches to sell their clients on the idea that 4 years is needed to really get rid of PUFA stores, but the reality may be that. Unless otherwise proven.
As sure as the sun rises and sets, people who can't accept the long time it takes to get rid of PUFA stores in order to live a healthy lifestyle that relies on sugar metabolusm primarily- they would have to embrace the false nutritional lifestyles centered on keto and carnivore. But for their lack of the patience of a turtle, they won't have the kind of health that comes from being less stressed, as their body would have to rely on adaptations that necessitate the production of stress hormones to keep their body in survival mode. On vicious cycles instead of virtuous cycles. One is low energy and shorter lived. The other high energy and longer lived.
It's better to keep your confused comments on the other post, you clearly said weeks ago that the practical application of an "optimal sugar metabolism" is what's missing from Raymond Peat's ideas, and didn't answer when I asked if you reached it practically, and now you claim you reached it through Ray Peat's ideas, no sense.
That's what you said weeks ago, either you're confused, or you're lying, or you don't know how to express your ideas:
@yerrag said in Banned from RP forum : Can you do better than this.:
RPF, as I said in previous a previous, has been a failure. Its main pillar is that optimal sugar metabolism is the key to health. Yet the site is vexed and stuck in not knowing how to make its members transform themselves from being poor sugar metabolizers into optimal sugar metabolizers. Ray Peat spoke only about the superiority of having optimal sugar metabolism, bit never spoke how to go about making that transformation. The site could have provided that a workable blueprint on how to go about that transformation, thus enabling many members towards the path to metabolic health. But it never got that going. There was a member named Cirion. He was piling on weight taking in lots of sugar because he believed sugar was good, but his body did not metabolize sugar well, and so he suddenly dropped out never to be heard from again. We don't really know if is still alive.
I feel charlie would be better off refocusing the website towards making the transformation to optimal sugar metabolism be a key goal before he embarked on his anti-peat mission
No sense at all talking sense to you. You've drawn a line in the sand. My attempts at correcting your abject lack of comprehension fail because of your insistence that your interpretation of what I said is what I meant. How is that for being exhibit A for being anal? I am the source of a ststement that you ask me to clarify, and deapite my doing so, you doggedly insist on tour interpretation.
I will just shake the dirt off my sandals and say anathema with you! May I be the last to cast you as good riddance! Have a nice life.
Temporal thinking is the faculty that’s
engaged by an enriched environment, but it’s
wrong to call it “thinking,” because it’s simply
the way organisms exist... - Ray Peat Nov 2017 Newsletter -
@yerrag said in Beware of the Low Vitamin A Zealots- New Thorough Video by Mike Fave:
@Truth said in Beware of the Low Vitamin A Zealots- New Thorough Video by Mike Fave:
@yerrag said in Beware of the Low Vitamin A Zealots- New Thorough Video by Mike Fave:
Contrary to the delusional claim of @Truth that I wasn't successful in achieving optimal metabolism, I have achieved that already long ago. And it is by following Ray Peat. Certainly it is hard for health coaches to sell their clients on the idea that 4 years is needed to really get rid of PUFA stores, but the reality may be that. Unless otherwise proven.
As sure as the sun rises and sets, people who can't accept the long time it takes to get rid of PUFA stores in order to live a healthy lifestyle that relies on sugar metabolusm primarily- they would have to embrace the false nutritional lifestyles centered on keto and carnivore. But for their lack of the patience of a turtle, they won't have the kind of health that comes from being less stressed, as their body would have to rely on adaptations that necessitate the production of stress hormones to keep their body in survival mode. On vicious cycles instead of virtuous cycles. One is low energy and shorter lived. The other high energy and longer lived.
It's better to keep your confused comments on the other post, you clearly said weeks ago that the practical application of an "optimal sugar metabolism" is what's missing from Raymond Peat's ideas, and didn't answer when I asked if you reached it practically, and now you claim you reached it through Ray Peat's ideas, no sense.
That's what you said weeks ago, either you're confused, or you're lying, or you don't know how to express your ideas:
@yerrag said in Banned from RP forum : Can you do better than this.:
RPF, as I said in previous a previous, has been a failure. Its main pillar is that optimal sugar metabolism is the key to health. Yet the site is vexed and stuck in not knowing how to make its members transform themselves from being poor sugar metabolizers into optimal sugar metabolizers. Ray Peat spoke only about the superiority of having optimal sugar metabolism, bit never spoke how to go about making that transformation. The site could have provided that a workable blueprint on how to go about that transformation, thus enabling many members towards the path to metabolic health. But it never got that going. There was a member named Cirion. He was piling on weight taking in lots of sugar because he believed sugar was good, but his body did not metabolize sugar well, and so he suddenly dropped out never to be heard from again. We don't really know if is still alive.
I feel charlie would be better off refocusing the website towards making the transformation to optimal sugar metabolism be a key goal before he embarked on his anti-peat mission
No sense at all talking sense to you. You've drawn a line in the sand. My attempts at correcting your abject lack of comprehension fail because of your insistence that your interpretation of what I said is what I meant. How is that for being exhibit A for being anal? I am the source of a ststement that you ask me to clarify, and deapite my doing so, you doggedly insist on tour interpretation.
I will just shake the dirt off my sandals and say anathema with you! May I be the last to cast you as good riddance! Have a nice life.
Don't be a liar, or continue your confusion, if you genuinely believe that what I'm saying that your comments from weeks ago imply, doesn't correspond to your ideas or what you meant, you simply didn't convey your ideas in a way that corresponds to what you had in mind. My claim wasn't delusional at all, considering that's the most logical way to understand your comments, your non-answers to my questions about practical application, and your return to animosity and attempts at name-calling right after those questions. I didn't ask you to clarify
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@dan-dominic said in Beware of the Low Vitamin A Zealots- New Thorough Video by Mike Fave:
A lot of great points in this video:
Great video! Well worth the time.
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@yerrag well reasoned.
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I have been wondering how low can you go. An the long term consequences of going too low. This study was an eye opener. Eggs are a source of vitamin A.
Consumption of eggs and the 15-year incidence of age-related
macular degeneration
Background and aims: A naturally rich source of lutein and zeaxanthin are eggs. There is scarce epidemiological data on the temporal association between total egg consumption and age-related macular
degeneration (AMD) incidence. We aimed to establish the prospective and independent association
between consumption of eggs with the incidence of AMD over a 15-year follow-up.
Methods: In this population-based cohort study of 3,654 participants aged 49 þ years examined at
baseline, 2034 participants had complete information on baseline egg consumption and AMD signs over
15 years. AMD was determined from retinal photographs. Egg consumption was assessed using a semiquantitative food-frequency questionnaire. Total egg intake was calculated through summing up intakes
in all forms e.g. boiled, poached, fried, scrambled and/or omelette. We summarized total egg consumption into the following categories: 1 egg/week; 2-4 eggs/week; 5-6 eggs/week; and 1 egg/day.
Results: At baseline, participants who consumed 2-4 eggs/week compared to those who consumed 1
egg/week (reference group) had reduced risk of incident late-stage AMD after 15 years: multivariableadjusted odds ratio, OR, 0.51 (95% confidence intervals, CI, 0.28e0.92).
Participants who consumed 2
-4 eggs/week versus 1 egg/week at baseline had 62% reduced risk of developing neovascular AMD.
Among those whose AMD onset was at or before the 10-year follow-up, consumption of 2-4 and 5-6
eggs/week was associated with 54% and 65% reduced risk of incident late AMD**, respectively. When
analyzed as a dichotomized variable, participants who consumed >1 egg/week versus 1 egg/week at
baseline, had 46% reduced risk of developing late-stage AMD 15 years later: multivariable-adjusted OR
0.54 (95% CI 0.3e0.90). Non-significant associations were observed between egg consumption and
incident early AMD.
Conclusions: Our findings suggest that moderate consumption of eggs significantly reduces the risk of
developing incident late-stage AMD over 15 years.“All things are poison and nothing is without poison; only the dose makes a thing not a poison.” - Paracelsus (c. 1493–1541)
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@DavidPS I wouldnt be suprised if you can go many many years without it. All in all, Im skeptical of the mainstream view of what defines a vitamin or a nutrient. The thing is that what the deficiency studies on Vitamin A show is that this nutrient cures certain symptoms wihtin the organism. It is also a cofactor for steroids. And since I think that writing off good symtpoms as "stopping the detox" or "stress hormones" has no basis in reality, I accept all substances that promote recovery, strength, and stamina.
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If I were a betting man, I'd bet on the horse called Ray Peat. He's not going to win all races, but no horse will.
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@DavidPS said in Beware of the Low Vitamin A Zealots- New Thorough Video by Mike Fave:
I have been wondering how low can you go. An the long term consequences of going too low. This study was an eye opener. Eggs are a source of vitamin A.
Consumption of eggs and the 15-year incidence of age-related
macular degeneration
Background and aims: A naturally rich source of lutein and zeaxanthin are eggs. There is scarce epidemiological data on the temporal association between total egg consumption and age-related macular
degeneration (AMD) incidence. We aimed to establish the prospective and independent association
between consumption of eggs with the incidence of AMD over a 15-year follow-up.
Methods: In this population-based cohort study of 3,654 participants aged 49 þ years examined at
baseline, 2034 participants had complete information on baseline egg consumption and AMD signs over
15 years. AMD was determined from retinal photographs. Egg consumption was assessed using a semiquantitative food-frequency questionnaire. Total egg intake was calculated through summing up intakes
in all forms e.g. boiled, poached, fried, scrambled and/or omelette. We summarized total egg consumption into the following categories: 1 egg/week; 2-4 eggs/week; 5-6 eggs/week; and 1 egg/day.
Results: At baseline, participants who consumed 2-4 eggs/week compared to those who consumed 1
egg/week (reference group) had reduced risk of incident late-stage AMD after 15 years: multivariableadjusted odds ratio, OR, 0.51 (95% confidence intervals, CI, 0.28e0.92).
Participants who consumed 2
-4 eggs/week versus 1 egg/week at baseline had 62% reduced risk of developing neovascular AMD.
Among those whose AMD onset was at or before the 10-year follow-up, consumption of 2-4 and 5-6
eggs/week was associated with 54% and 65% reduced risk of incident late AMD**, respectively. When
analyzed as a dichotomized variable, participants who consumed >1 egg/week versus 1 egg/week at
baseline, had 46% reduced risk of developing late-stage AMD 15 years later: multivariable-adjusted OR
0.54 (95% CI 0.3e0.90). Non-significant associations were observed between egg consumption and
incident early AMD.
Conclusions: Our findings suggest that moderate consumption of eggs significantly reduces the risk of
developing incident late-stage AMD over 15 years.Interesting study.
It probably wasnt only the Vitamin A, but also (maybe even mainly) the B-Vitamins:"One randomized controlled trial showed that a daily supplementation of folic acid and vitamins B6 and B12 reduced the risk of AMD by 40% [22]."
Dare to think.
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@Mauritio - these are the carotenoids in eggs that I was thinking about with regard to the macular.
Lutein and Zeaxanthin and Their Roles in Age-Related Macular Degeneration—Neurodegenerative Disease
