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    Thyroid inflamation after months of supplementing

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    • EmiliaE
      Emilia @T-3
      last edited by Emilia

      @T-3 Thank you so much for your thoughtful and knowledgeable response.

      In terms of my current dietary approach, I typically consume around 1,500 - 2,000 mg of calcium daily, mostly from raw or unhomogenised organic milk, and quality cheeses; milk powder pancakes, fruits, honey, medjool dates, 100% dark chocolate, coffee, gelatin, organic meats, seafood (recommended by Dr. Peat), and eggs. I would occasionally eat well-cooked greens or drink their cooked juices. I follow a starch free diet 99% of the time with occasional mashed potatoes or homemade nixtamalised tortillas.

      I've experimented with cynomel and cynoplus on and off over the years, following advice from Dr. Ray Peat on dosage. While I initially saw positive results, I now face challenges even with small amounts of thyroid, despite a nutrient rich diet and adequate caloric intake.

      My current supplements include Progest-E, magnesium, vitamin D and K2, colostrum powder, placenta, bee pollen, B complex, pine pollen, acerola cherry powder, and powdered oyster extract when fresh oysters are unavailable.

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      • EmiliaE
        Emilia @T-3
        last edited by

        This post is deleted!
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        • B
          BroJonas @Emilia
          last edited by

          @Emilia

          Low cholesterol comes to mind as a possibility for thyroid intolerance.

          How are your temps anyway? Maybe extra thyroid isn’t really needed for u

          EmiliaE 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • EmiliaE
            Emilia @BroJonas
            last edited by

            @BroJonas thank you for your response. My cholesterol levels aren't low. I often have cold hands though, classical symptoms..

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            • EmiliaE
              Emilia @BroJonas
              last edited by

              @BroJonas I have some genetic markers for thyroid hormone resistance.

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              • T
                T-3 @Emilia
                last edited by T-3

                @Emilia Your diet sounds on-point, delicious and brilliantly pro-metabolic. I'm glad you mentioned about your cholesterol levels being adequate (for endogenous youth-steroid production), which is another important consideration when trying to rule out mechanisms that may lead to unwanted symptoms in general and to thyroid supplementation in particular.

                Warm temperature in the hands and fingers, reaction speed (moderately quick "twitchiness" in the heel/hands/wrists) and absent brain fog (cognitive tone that wants to "see new possibilities", hungry for new insight, sensitive to aesthetics, e.g. 5-sense sensory pleasure of being outdoors, at least some fleeting moments of child-like "wonder", as Peat repeatedly mentioned) are among my most reliable "intuitive" indicators of good thyroid/metabolic status. Now I better understand your frustration: having on-point pro-metabolic diet for years on end and yet cold fingers as a persistent sign of (or consistent with) hypothyroidism or some metabolic block to achieving comfortably warm body temperature.

                Just on a hunch: might you consider trying a quarter or half a grain of NDT?

                I mostly prefer T3. But for whole-body warmth, there are times when NDT outperforms, especially in wintertime. I think NDT is more complex. I've had paradoxical responses to it after being on it regularly for multiple months, which brings me back to nibbling a T3 tablet as the simplest and most direct way for me to achieve the pro-metabolic markers I'm able to perceive. I use NDT sporadically every winter, usually for a spell of 3 or 5 days every few weeks if I don't get as much sunshine as I'd like, or am unusually busy with a work project that keeps me stuck in the office or sleep-deprived (e.g., international travel).

                Please let us know if you figure anything out (with or without exogenous thyroid) that returns warmth to your hands and achieves the pro-metabolic markers you're wanting.

                EmiliaE 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • EmiliaE
                  Emilia @T-3
                  last edited by

                  @T-3 thank you for your valuable time.

                  1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • LucHL
                    LucH @T-3
                    last edited by LucH

                    @T-3 said in Thyroid inflammation after months of supplementing:

                    This is important information to consider: that deiodinase 3, and not RT3, inactivates T3:

                    Well seen 👍
                    Deiodinase and halogens
                    *) Watch out for fluorine, chlorine and bromine
                    Deiodination is essential to maintain TH homeostasis, and disruption can have detrimental effects. Halogen bonding (XB) to the selenium of the selenocysteine (Sec) residue in the Dio active site has been proposed to contribute to the mechanism for iodine exclusion.
                    Xenobiotics could also inhibit Dio activity by competitively binding to the active sites of thyroid.
                    Source:
                    A Halogen Bonding Perspective on Iodothyronine Deiodinase Activity
                    DOI: 10.3390/molecules25061328
                    *) Induced reasoning
                    If fluorine (toothpaste), chlorine (water) or bromine (nuts, seeds and fish, inorganic fruits):
                    If e.g. fluorine occupies the place of selenium on D3 (Deiodinase 3), the thyroid cannot function properly. This can lead to excess, with non -assimilated elements when taking a supplement with T3. rT3 will be too high at the final step. =>

                    Deiodinases control local cellular and systemic thyroid hormone availability.

                    Reverse T3 (rT3) is a metabolically inactive form of thyroid hormone, which is generated from T4 via the type 3 5′-deiodinase enzyme.
                    Several other conditions also are known to lead to increased production of RT3, including stress, severe dieting, low serum iron levels, cortisol deficiency and diabetes.
                    *) Useful nutrients
                    Micronutrients as iodine, selenium, magnesium, iron, zinc, and vitamins B12, D3, and A.
                    DOI: 10.1097/MED.0000000000000831
                    Note: Before taking any iodine supplement, selenium has to be brought to, even in the case of Hashimoto suspected.

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                    • B
                      BroJonas
                      last edited by

                      Peat liked to see a minimum of 160ng/dl cholesterol before adding in extra thyroid in case anyone is wondering

                      DonkeyDudeD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                      • DonkeyDudeD
                        DonkeyDude @BroJonas
                        last edited by

                        @BroJonas only 160? Do you have a source for that? My wife has 164 and I thought it's too low; I recall reading that he considered 160 while already on thyroid acceptable.

                        DavidPSD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                        • DavidPSD
                          DavidPS @DonkeyDude
                          last edited by

                          @DonkeyDude said in Thyroid inflamation after months of supplementing:

                          only 160? Do you have a source for that?

                          Dr. Peat . . . . anywhere between 160 and 230, it's a healthy range

                          https://www.bioenergetic.life/clips/57dac?t=2253&c=50

                          ““Effective health care depends on self-care” - Ivan Illich, 👀
                          ☂️

                          DonkeyDudeD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • DonkeyDudeD
                            DonkeyDude @DavidPS
                            last edited by DonkeyDude

                            @DavidPS Thanks! Still, wouldn't it mean that 164 is a tad low for thyroid supplementation?

                            DavidPSD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • DavidPSD
                              DavidPS @DonkeyDude
                              last edited by DavidPS

                              @DonkeyDude - 164 is within Dr. Peat's range, so it it not low. But it is not optium either. I queried Peatbot.com.

                              User: what is the optium level of cholesterol

                              Peatbot.com: The optimal level of cholesterol, particularly for longevity and maintaining mental function, appears to be around 270 milligrams per deciliter (mg/dL). This is based on studies of older women and observations from rest homes, where those with a cholesterol level of 270 mg/dL had the best longevity and functionality. Additionally, the Framingham study indicated that people over the age of 50 with cholesterol levels below 200 mg/dL were more likely to develop dementia.

                              ““Effective health care depends on self-care” - Ivan Illich, 👀
                              ☂️

                              DonkeyDudeD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • DonkeyDudeD
                                DonkeyDude @DavidPS
                                last edited by

                                @DavidPS but in the quoted statement he has also said that

                                But if your thyroid is a little more active, the cholesterol will probably go down to 200 or 190.

                                So if my wife started using thyroid, wouldn't her cholesterol dip below 160? Also, 270 as an optimum level sounds pretty insane and incongruent with the aforementioned quote.

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                                • DavidPSD
                                  DavidPS @DonkeyDude
                                  last edited by

                                  @DonkeyDude - I agree. There appears to be a conflict in Dr. Peat's statements.

                                  Here is a link to a YouTube video.

                                  Ray Peat KMUD 12-19-08 Cholesterol is an Important Molecule Full Interview

                                  ““Effective health care depends on self-care” - Ivan Illich, 👀
                                  ☂️

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                                  • E
                                    Ecstatic_Hamster @A Former User
                                    last edited by

                                    @Sippy what are your liver enzyme numbers?

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                                    • E
                                      Ecstatic_Hamster @DonkeyDude
                                      last edited by

                                      @DonkeyDude a little Pregnenolone will keep cholesterol from falling with thyroid supplementation.

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                                      • ?
                                        A Former User @Ecstatic_Hamster
                                        last edited by

                                        @Ecstatic_Hamster Here are my labs:

                                        b2b898ed-5d00-406e-a0b6-8ba5897b9658-image.png
                                        386a6a63-b4cb-4061-ae43-0b11a974f7a6-image.png
                                        ccd6b7ae-9f2b-4cb6-9c40-398a30941dc3-image.png
                                        e9120056-427b-49c0-a12c-9333b3aa0af9-image.png
                                        0650a950-60c1-47c5-85fe-a7845e543428-image.png
                                        4864251b-0bf5-4ac8-8302-401d67f61b2a-image.png

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                                        • T
                                          T-3 @LucH
                                          last edited by T-3

                                          @LucH Good post. From those studies, do we think there are actionable dietary strategies or supplements that would specifically help keep reverse-T3 levels low or reasonably "under control"? Making sure there's plenty of selenium and (from the posts by @BroJonas, @DavidPS and @DonkeyDude ) total cholesterol>160 (or greater). Does that match your interpretation of what those studies and Peat's quotes imply about what can be done to promote pro-metabolic, well-functioning Deiodinases-3 and limit antimetabolic/high levels of reverse-T3? What else?

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                                          • E
                                            Ecstatic_Hamster @A Former User
                                            last edited by

                                            @Sippy not sure why it works, but often taking dry E, vitamin E succinate, can lower liver enzymes to normal levels within a few months.

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