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    Revisiting Oral Testosterone

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    • R
      RFC32 @jamezb46
      last edited by

      @jamezb46 it uses hbpcd just like the other sublingual studies.

      I don’t know these site rules but I do have a link to the seller, but it’s an underground overseas steroid lab basically.

      W M 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • W
        wester130 @RFC32
        last edited by wester130

        @RFC32

        half lfie looks very short though, they never overcame this problem

        I think vitamin E is the only thing that overcomes the short half life

        off topic - they are making DMT sublingual with HPBCD

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        • M
          metabolicmilk @RFC32
          last edited by

          @RFC32 @wester130 what are the pros/cons of vitamin e vs HPBCD ?

          W 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
          • W
            wester130 @metabolicmilk
            last edited by wester130

            @metabolicmilk said in Revisiting Oral Testosterone:

            HPBCD

            vitamin E hypothetically increases half life and total body absorption.
            however - no studies on the internet exist of people doing testosterone base in vitamin E

            HPBCD seems to work and could help for about 6 hours, but still goes to the liver

            this patent explains why steroids dissolved in vitamin e works so well

            https://patents.google.com/patent/CN111529488A/en

            also,
            https://bioenergetic.forum/topic/1043/vitamin-e-as-solvent-for-hormones/4

            https://raypeatforum.com/community/threads/molecules-dissolved-in-vitamin-e-preferentially-target-brain-injuries.51283/

            R 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • R
              RFC32 @wester130
              last edited by RFC32

              @wester130 thank you!

              And yes, half life is noticeably short, I peak after an hour and then the difference is noticeable after three hours.

              It’s actually a problem as well, because you can’t load your dose up high or things feel awful fast when everything hits at once.

              I am definitely allergic to hbcpd though which is unfortunate.

              Edit: I want to add that the low half life of HBCPD with testosterone is well supported in literature. When they used it in testing they did 5 mg 3 times a day to get testosterone levels up to acceptable.

              My assumption is with vitamin e we may be able to increase dosage and decrease frequency, or even do the same and see how it goes.

              I know people in the forums were talking about how 1mg Ray would take seems way too little. But my experience with sublingual shows there is likely a large effect.

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              • M
                metabolicmilk
                last edited by

                What do you think the ultimate hormone stack ratio would be?

                I think a solution of 4:3:3:1 of T:DHT:Prog:DHEA sounds good.

                Also - What do you think about making a solution of 80:20 Vitamin E : DMSO

                Just for better absorption and solubility of hormones.

                jamezb46J R 3 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • M
                  metabolicmilk
                  last edited by

                  @RFC32 @wester130

                  What are your favourite sources of vitamin E?

                  W 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                  • W
                    wester130 @metabolicmilk
                    last edited by

                    @metabolicmilk said in Revisiting Oral Testosterone:

                    @RFC32 @wester130

                    What are your favourite sources of vitamin E?

                    healthnatura

                    idealabs

                    cliganic looks interesting

                    now foods make a basic vitamin e that is acceptable

                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                    • jamezb46J
                      jamezb46 @metabolicmilk
                      last edited by

                      @metabolicmilk

                      Hey that’s my ratio 😍

                      In time there is life but no knowledge; outside time there is knowledge but no life

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                      • jamezb46J
                        jamezb46 @metabolicmilk
                        last edited by

                        @metabolicmilk

                        I could not get vitamin E to mix with DMSO, I would not recommend this. Unless you’re talking about dissolving d-alpha tocopherol acetate in DMSO. That may well work, but according to Ray the acetate ester is about 50% as effective as the nonesterified tocopherols.

                        In time there is life but no knowledge; outside time there is knowledge but no life

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                        • R
                          RFC32 @metabolicmilk
                          last edited by

                          @metabolicmilk

                          If you’re going to go dmso just go straight dmso and apply on the balls. Otherwise tocopherol and ethanol sublingual seems best to me.

                          Testosterone has felt so much better to me than the other hormones to me that’s the ultimate one.

                          I avoid dmso because it makes my breath and sweat smell so my wife doesn’t like it. Also anything topical I worry about getting on my kids, especially if it’s in large amounts. Too easily to spill, get on clothing, or get on hands. I know dmso fully absorbs but I still have trouble trusting it, if my kids had hormonal issues from my experiments I’d never forgive myself.

                          I’m considering just injecting but my wife is against it. Managing estrogen is a pain but I’m willing to do it.

                          I will say pregnenolone and DHEA help my brain function a lot. Chess scores go way up as does mood.

                          PrinceTrebataP thyroidchor27T 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • Crypt KeeperC
                            Crypt Keeper
                            last edited by

                            I tried an experiment to dissolve testosterone powder in NOW Vitamin E oil and even at 8 drops (1133% RDA of Vitamin E) I could not get 5mg of testosterone to dissolve.

                            My conclusion is that Vitamin E is not a practical solvent for testosterone ingestion.

                            W jamezb46J 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • W
                              wester130 @Crypt Keeper
                              last edited by

                              @Crypt-Keeper just 5ml of food grade ethanol mixed in would solve it

                              1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • PrinceTrebataP
                                PrinceTrebata @RFC32
                                last edited by

                                @RFC32 Whats your pregnenolone dose, and source?

                                KilgoreK 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • KilgoreK
                                  Kilgore @PrinceTrebata
                                  last edited by

                                  @PrinceTrebata Be careful where you order from as my Pregnenolone and Progesterone was refused by Canadian Customs

                                  I think if you order from Idealabs it will get through as I got my CortiNon (Progesterone + DHEA) from there with no issues.

                                  PrinceTrebataP 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                  • PrinceTrebataP
                                    PrinceTrebata @Kilgore
                                    last edited by

                                    @Kilgore Thanks for the heads up! I live close to the border so I might set up a po box and and pick it up. I wonder why the Canadian government is so tight fisted about supplements.

                                    1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                    • jamezb46J
                                      jamezb46 @Crypt Keeper
                                      last edited by

                                      @Crypt-Keeper that was my experience also. It dissolves very well in DMSO + Ethanol, however. Transdermal is the way I think.

                                      In time there is life but no knowledge; outside time there is knowledge but no life

                                      Crypt KeeperC 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • Crypt KeeperC
                                        Crypt Keeper @jamezb46
                                        last edited by

                                        @jamezb46 Yeah that sounds about right. I'm just trying to minimize the DHT conversion to get the most test out of it. I already have enough DHT. I can see why people just straight pin this stuff.

                                        PrinceTrebataP 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • PrinceTrebataP
                                          PrinceTrebata @Crypt Keeper
                                          last edited by

                                          @Crypt-Keeper If you don't mind could you dm or share your DHT source?

                                          Crypt KeeperC 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                          • thyroidchor27T
                                            thyroidchor27 @RFC32
                                            last edited by

                                            @RFC32 does testosterone feel better than DHT for you?

                                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
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