Bloodwork shows elevated TPOAb (Hashimoto's disease)

[Insr]

@NNight

Thanks! Is there anything specifically that suggests those to you?

Selenium: Cronometer says I get 230mcg, over 4x the RDA. I eat a brazil nut daily, and eggs. Should I get more?
Boron: I don't know much about boron. Quickly scanning lists of high boron foods shows a lot of plant foods like nuts that I don't eat much. So I could be low in this!

[NNight]

Both are involved in the antioxidant system.
It's especially known regarding selenium but I think it's also true for boron.
Boron seems to have a particular affinity with the thyroid which is intriguing.
IMO, boron can be seen as an element that could balance the action of iodine in the thyroid.
I don't think there are papers showing an improvement of Hashimotos with boron though, as I'm not sure it has even been studied.
Keep in mind that too much could be detrimental too.

[NNight]

Grapes are high in boron and so is wine.
Apples too.

[LucH]

@insufferable said in Bloodwork shows elevated TPOAb (Hashimoto's disease):

Is there anything specifically that suggests those to you?

Hi,
One clue: Jean Seignalet, French immunologist, thought that this auto-immune illness could have been enhanced by a xenopathogen, an antibacterial peptide coming from a bacteria or food, passing along the intestines. This peptide is then presented by HLA-DR to T CD+ lymphocytes. An autoimmune reaction happens and inflammation is then going to dampen and attack the thyroid function.

[16charactersitis]

@insufferable selenium you can get from seafood. Also mushrooms. Just make sure they’re well cooked. Raw mushrooms have unhealthy or toxic components that are eliminated via cooking

[Insr]

Thank you for your advice everyone. Much appreciated.

Stopping iodized salt is working! My temperature has increased a bit and my mental abilities are improved. I'm tracking my temperatures daily and will probably post soon when I have more data.

[Jennifer]

@insufferable said in Bloodwork shows elevated TPOAb (Hashimoto's disease):

There is also a lot of iodine in dairy now, not for natural reasons, but because it is added to the cows' feed (often as ethylenediamine dihydroiodide), and because iodophor is used to disinfect milking equipment. There is iodophor in your milk!

In Denmark, 1 cup of milk has 27mcg iodine.

In Norway, 1 cup of organic milk in the summer (so the cows are probably eating pasture only) has 14 mcg iodine.

But in the US, 1 cup of normal milk has 84 mcg. (56% of the RDA)

Chickens are also given extra iodine in their feed (probably in the form of calcium iodate) and so 1 egg has 26 mcg iodine. (I don't know what the natural level for eggs is.)

Regarding iodine added to animal feed: "The iodine content of food of animal origin, if produced taking account of the currently authorised maximum content of iodine in feed, would represent a substantial risk to high consumers. The risk would originate primarily from the consumption of milk and to a minor extent from eggs. The UL for adults (600 µg/day) and for toddlers (200 µg/day) would be exceeded by a factor of 2 and 4, respectively." (Europe's upper limit is 600mcg apparently, but the USA's upper limit is 1100mcg)
https://www.efsa.europa.eu/en/efsajournal/pub/3100

Maybe iodine naturally present in food isn't bad even in a moderate excess and there's something especially wrong with the "unnatural" types of iodine that they add to salt, animal feed, and that they use to disinfect dairy. Maybe the body attacks the thyroid, when the thyroid takes in these "weird" types of iodine.

I will definitely stop using iodized salt and see what happens on my next bloodwork. I'm considering stopping dairy (and eggs?) too.

What do you think? I've never heard anyone, mainstream or alt-health, talk about this! (aside from Ray being against too much iodine, but he must not have known about the milk)

If this helps ease concerns, I was diagnosed with Hashimoto’s and brought my elevated TPO level down on a (pastured) dairy-based diet. I was averaging daily at least 2 liters of milk, a few ounces of cheese and 2–3 eggs. The goats were given free choice minerals that contained kelp and in the spring would load up on it so much so that I could taste the kelp in their milk—it tasted fishy. Even still, my TPO level normalized. I’ve avoided iodized salt since before finding Ray’s work because of the anti-caking agents. I used a French Celtic salt by Eden and a sea salt by Jacobsen Salt Co., but now use Morton’s canning & pickling salt.

[LucH]

@insufferable said in Bloodwork shows elevated TPOAb (Hashimoto's disease):

Stopping iodized salt is working!

Well, you reach a staple: Too much of a good thing is bad, especially with a overreactive thyroid when it's inflamed. Adapt to your sensations.

For other readers.
If I summarize: No iodine supplement (titled 125 mcg) without taking first selenium (100- 200 mcg).
We need to make staples (10-15 days). If overreaction, stop the supplement.
Details below:

Hashimoto, cruciferous & iodine

Cruciferous vegetables contain thioglucosides that are metabolized to thiocyanates. Thiocyanates compounds inhibit iodine transport and the incorporation of iodide into thyroglobulin, thus increasing TSH secretion and thyroid cells proliferation.
Here are some members of the brassicaceae family, cruciferous vegetables that includes broccoli, Brussels sprouts, cabbage, cauliflower, collard greens, kale, turnips, corn salad (lamb lettuce) and watercress, radish and nearly all the cabbage family (pakchoï, mustard, wasabi, etc.).
https://www.gardeningknowhow.com/edible/vegetables/vgen/cruciferous-vegetables.htm
Moderated consumption of cruciferous greens doesn’t affect the thyroid function, but well if you drink a smoothie every day with such greens. Similarly, consumption of high amounts of cruciferous vegetables has been associated with increased thyroid cancer risk only in iodine-deficient areas (57). The concern has been that they may interfere with the production of thyroid hormone if you have an iodine deficiency. Those vegetables are said to be goitrogens.
So we need iodine, preferably from food, but before taking a moderate supplement of iodine, in the case of Hashimoto’s – event if we ‘re told not to – we have to be replenished first with selenium (55 mcg Se is the RDA). Be careful when dosing iodine as too much at once can be toxic.
However, any supplement can have an adverse reaction in an individual. So adapt yourself to the ground, how you feel. And take time to adapt: we need staples 10-15 days to adapt oneself and see the effect on thyroid. Moreover, if your thyroid is inflamed (immune reaction), you’ll need antioxidants to dampen the possible overreaction (Se 200 mcg and Vit C 600 – 1 000 mg, split into 2 or 3 takes, because of half-life).
Precaution: No manganese as a supplement; only from food. No vitamin C at the same time as kelp supplement, even if it very low titled (125 mcg). No need to take it every day, especially when you eat fish or seafood.
I repeat: We have to manage to avoid a possible overreaction: Iodine is a mighty antioxidant (it protects against free radicals and peroxides), has strong bactericidal as well as antiviral and antifungal activity. No need to overstimulate a wounded organ. An unadapt dose of iodine can trigger or worsen hypothyroidism.
Finally, if you seem to react to goitrogens, you may also wish to look into SIBO, sulfur sensitivity, iodine deficiency and the CBS gene mutation…

Sources & References
*) Iodine and thyroid function
https://lpi.oregonstate.edu/mic/food-beverages/cruciferous-vegetables#:~:text=One study in humans found,-deficient areas (57).

*) Goitrogen effect of some foods
https://thyroidpharmacist.com/articles/what-are-goitrogens-and-do-they-matter-with-hashimotos/

*) Controversy of iodine in Hashimoto
https://thyroidpharmacist.com/articles/iodine-hashimotos/
• The controversy around iodine
• How iodine affects Hashimoto’s
• The sweet spot for iodine
Excerpt:
Any supplement can have an adverse reaction in an individual, and I wish this was a one-time report, but I have received countless messages like the one above, and have seen many similar reports in clients who came to me after trying high dose iodine on their own, or with other practitioners.
Initially, a person given iodine may experience more energy, but they then crash and feel worse. This is because iodine, given to a subset of people with Hashimoto’s, can make the thyroid produce more hormone initially, but unfortunately, in doing so without having enough selenium and antioxidants on board, the increased hormone production creates lots of free radicals, which can flare up the attack on the thyroid gland.
Iodine needs to be processed by the thyroid gland, and when the thyroid is inflamed, the processing of iodine will likely produce more inflammation. If you give an angry and overwhelmed organ more work to do, you’ll likely see it become even angrier!
A person may feel more energetic when first starting an iodine supplement, but lab tests will reveal that their “new energy” is coming from the destruction of thyroid tissue, which dumps thyroid hormone into the circulation. Reports will show an elevated TSH, elevated thyroid antibodies, and in some cases, low levels of active thyroid hormones.
This is why I don’t generally recommend iodine supplements to people with Hashimoto’s. I don’t believe that the short-term artificial boost in energy is worth destroying your thyroid gland!

*) Antioxidants are crucial to thyroid health…
https://thyroidpharmacist.com/articles/nutrient-depletions-vi-antioxidants/#:~:text=Antioxidants are crucial to thyroid,the minerals selenium and manganese.

*) Iodine has strong bactericidal as well as antiviral and antifungal activity.
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8709459/
*) Role of dietary iodine and cruciferous vegetables in thyroid cancer
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3496161/
Iodine is a micronutrient necessary for human development and health. It is required for the synthesis of thyroxine (T4) and triiodothyronine (T3).

*) Recommended Amounts for Iodine
https://nutritionsource.hsph.harvard.edu/iodine/
RDA iodine is 150 mcg
Iodine is needed to make the thyroid hormones thyroxine and triiodothyronine, which assist with the creation of proteins and enzyme activity, as well as regulating normal metabolism.
Iodine is required in the process of formation of deiodinase (Dio) enzymes. They’re 4 types Dio
What is the role of deiodinase 1?
Deiodinases are important for determining intracellular thyroid hormone availability. Type 1 deiodinase (Dio1) is expressed in the liver, kidney, thyroid, and pituitary. Dio1 catalyzes outer and inner ring deiodination of T4, T3, and rT3, and, thus, can both activate and inactivate thyroid hormone.

[Insr]

@Jennifer Good to know, thank you! I'm glad you had success and that it can be done!

Do you happen to know if the goats' udders and the dairy equipment were being treated with disinfectants or not?

@LucH Thank you for the detailed info. I like this article that you posted. https://thyroidpharmacist.com/articles/iodine-hashimotos/
From that article:
Iran: 3.2% of people had TPOAb antibodies before salt iodization, 12.5% had them after.
Minnesota: "Starting with the first decade after iodine fortification, they documented a 2,500 percent increase in Hashimoto’s disease."

I guess my selenium wasn't high enough for my iodine consumption? Cronometer says I generally got 230mcg selenium, which is ~4.2x the RDA. But with high iodine, maybe I needed a lot more.

My iodine consumption a few months ago was around 982mcg, and more recently (at the time of my bloodwork) was 722mcg. Now, having removed iodized salt, my iodine is about 436mcg and things have improved a lot so far.

[LucH]

@Insr said in Bloodwork shows elevated TPOAb (Hashimoto's disease):

my iodine is about 436mcg and things have improved a lot so far.

No need to be so high. I'd target 150 - 300 mcg Iodine, the lower side (125 mcg) when thyroid is inflamed. Not necessary every day. But with take of selenium first (200 mcg) in both case. When replenished, slow down Se. And adapt with long staples enough to see if you tolerate it well.
Adapt to what your body tells you.

Edit: Mind iodonized salt. Not always thé right kind. It can block receptors.

[Jennifer]

@Insr, the udders and equipment are treated with a (natural) disinfectant, yes. I don’t know of any farm here that doesn’t disinfect them, but the majority sell raw dairy so maybe they’re extra cautious to prevent contamination and/or it’s a law. I’m not sure. It will be interesting to see if your prolactin also comes down. I noticed yours is at the higher end for a man. I had in my notes that Ray said a normal range for men is 4–7. Mine averages between 10 and 11.

[Insr]

Thanks LucH and Jennifer.

Yeah, I hope the prolactin comes down with improved thyroid!