moderate protein restriction can cure all ills
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@Ecstatic_Hamster said in moderate protein restriction can cure all ills:
They used obese people, after 4 months, and put them on the lower protein for maintenance.
Yes, interesting: need to be reported as case-report.
I’m going to try not to be too long or too esoteric
When dieting, you optimize one process: Brain rejuvenation and the body gets rid of mad cells (cancer prevention). You get this schema as long as you metabolize well.
The body recycles what’s going wrong as long as you don’t lack fuel, fuel coming from fat, or preferably from carbs. Which kind of carbs, it’s another problem. Let’s says the one you metabolize well, to be short.
And the answer won’t be the same for everybody.
If you’re dieting for a long period, let’s say you do it correctly:
80 % of your needed calories, according to your metabolism. Required GPL, appropriate acidosis balance (no lack of bases). You listen to your body needs and adapt yourself if necessary. So you perceive, think and act whenever it’s required. No static point of view. You can re-think and change your mind if the body sends repeated messages.Total target: 80 % of required calories.
P 20 % minimum (target 30%).
L 10-40% with as little PUFA possible. Vit E (mix toco) and astaxanthin (4 mg 1x/day) needed if
losing fat (weight loss). You live on your reserves.
G: The rest. I'd target 40 % percent of required calories, trying to optimize glycemia. See Jessie Inaupsche (Glucose Goddess) if you want advices to deal well with glycemia. Or I can give a link (In French, the link, but it's an easy "principle" to understand).
GPL: G stands for glucids (carbs), P for proteins, L for lipids.Keep in mind that people who’ve changed the type of diet (proportion and type of GPL) could have problems after +/ 5 years term. They've lived on their reserves (provisions).
Let’s take an example: Some vegans do it well so, provided they bring correct stuff and don’t starve the body. There are several cases of high level sportswomen, trying to be fit, who are no longer able to get pregnant. Too much of a good thing is bad. Too stressful.
Idem whenever you lack the right type of amino acids or when you eat / ingest too much vegetable oil (PUFA’s are in excess). It’s a delay-action bomb. -
@Ecstatic_Hamster
Great study! Thanks for sharing.Here's an important part of the study:
Energy expenditure decreased in CR by about 6%, while it didn't in PR.
In CR, VO2 and VCO2 , respiratory quotient,
and carb oxidation decreased (-77%!) while it didn't decrease in PR.
That is all in line with what I saw in previous studies.
PR for the win.
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I'm thinking about a modified version of protein restriction ATM.
If you'd have most of your protein at a certain point in time if the day , you'd get a big part of the MR/PR benefits.
In animals beneficial metabolic changes like an increase in FGF21 started showing after only 6h of the diet.
So if you eat a significant amount of protein only once a day, you get an 18h window of the benefits.I thinks that's a reason why (intermittent) fasting works to some degree: You're restricting protein.
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For neophytes:
MS= Metabolic Syndrome
DR = Dietary restriction
CR = calorie restriction
PR = Protein restriction
isocaloric dietary protein => iso => what is required; according to RDA.Excerpt 1:
Protein restriction is sufficient to confer almost the same clinical outcomes as calorie restriction without the need for a reduction in calorie intake. The isocaloric characteristic of the PR intervention makes this approach a more attractive and less drastic dietary strategy in clinical settings and has more significant potential to be used as adjuvant therapy for people with metabolic syndrome.
Excerpt 2
More strikingly, both CR and PR improved insulin sensitivity by 62.3% and 93.2%, respectively, after treatment. Fecal microbiome diversity was not affected by the interventions.
Comment (LucH) :
It’s necessary to eat carbs at minima when ingesting meat. Not much. Otherwise you’ll get an insulin spike and the secretion of adrenaline and cortisol due to a lack of immediate fuel. Stressful and counterproductive. -
It’s necessary to eat carbs at minima when ingesting meat. Not much. Otherwise you’ll get an insulin spike and the secretion of adrenaline and cortisol due to a lack of immediate fuel. Stressful and counterproductive.
What? Are you saying if you eat more carbs with meat, you’ll lack immediate fuel? That it’s stressful and raises cortisol and adrenaline?
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@LetTheRedeemed said in moderate protein restriction can cure all ills:
What? Are you saying if you eat more carbs with meat, you’ll lack immediate fuel?
No, WE need some carbs when eating meat. Not much required. A tomato or an orange IS fine. I Can show it with a graph if desired.
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@LucH ok gotcha
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@Mauritio I do exactly this. Large window of sugar-only from morning past noon (5:00AM-1:00PM) with nothing but honey, sugar, and some fruit. Then I excercise and 3-4 hour fast to allow last bit of blood sugar to be used up, then a big protein dinner around 5:00 or 6:00 PM. Its going great I totally recommend the intermittent protein restriction idea.
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@Serotoninskeptic said in moderate protein restriction can cure all ills:
then a big protein dinner around 5:00 or 6:00 PM. Its going great I totally recommend the intermittent protein restriction idea.
You'd better take first a fruit or a tomato if you don't want to burn muscles.
A few carbs is required, not to secrete adrenaline and cortisol afterwards. -
The big issue with this is something that I noticed when I was doing the warrior diet.
You really can’t metabolize more than around 25 or 30 g of protein at a time.
So your protein may be too low if you’re doing only one protein meal.
And you’re loading yourself with a lot of protein at one time, which increases ammonia levels and stresses your kidneys.
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great study! Thx for sharing.
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@Ecstatic_Hamster pretty sure protein intake translation to increased muscle protein synthesis doesnt even begin topping out until 75-100g protein at one meal . irrespective of increased ammonia which maybe signals incomplete but not totally stopped protein utilization for better pathway
