L. Reuteri

LetTheRedeemed

I keep browsing thru this thread:
https://raypeatforum.com/community/threads/gut-bacteria-may-cause-all-autoimmune-conditions-antibiotics-can-cure.22983/page-3

It looks like the best course of action will be to definitively kill (as best can be reckoned) infection of the lymphatic system, then it may be safer to try a probiotic.

L reuteri will definitely be in my short list of things to try

Mauritio

In this study they showed that feeding flies L. Reuteris (ATCC strain SD-5865) it increased their life span by about 14%.

The mechanism was (amongst others)a decrease in IGF1, similarly to protein restriction.

Young flies were especially susceptible to the effects, their food intake was increased by 53% and their activity level was increased by 95%. l. Reuteri is/was part of the human milk microbiome so maybe it is supposed to be there in young animals

The flies also weighed less and consumed more food.

L. Reuteri decreases the abundance of bacteria in the gut, mostly by production reuterin. Giving flies reuterin alone increased their life span by up to 11% , indicating that it is largely responsible for the the life span. Increase of L. reuteri.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10389828/

happyhanneke

@AinmBeo
I've always made yogurt with raw milk.
Do you use skim or whole milk?

AinmBeo

@happyhanneke
Skim A2 pasteurized cow milk

DavidPS

I use pasterized or ultra pasterized milk. For me, the idea is to have only the reuteri bacteria fermenting. Other strains of bateria in raw milk may also grow during the process and compete with the reuteri.

Amazoniac

@LetTheRedeemed said in L. Reuteri:

@Amazoniac yeaahhh... I had some concerns too, because of some old posts by Georgi...

Well, the study below finally provides direct evidence that Lupus can be triggered by a bacterial strain commonly found in many probiotic products - Lactobacillus reuteri.
Lactobacillus reuteri - Wikipedia

In light of the continuously accumulating evidence that bacterial overgrowth in colon has a role in virtually all chronic diseases, I would be very wary of exogenous supplementation unless there is proven colonization with a much more dangerous pathogen.

https://www.cell.com/cell-host-micr...7.383612938.1545923258-233655730.1545923257#
https://www.genengnews.com/news/microbiome-changes-through-diet-may-help-ease-lupus-symptoms/

“We dissected, molecularly, how diets can work on the gut microbiome,” said senior author Martin Kriegel, M.D., Ph.D., associate professor adjunct in the department of immunobiology, Yale University School of Medicine. “We identified a pathway that is driving autoimmune disease and mitigated by the diet.” The paper, A Diet-Sensitive Commensal Lactobacillus Strain Mediates TLR7-Dependent Systemic Autoimmunity was published recently in Cell Host & Microbe. The team first identified the bacterium, Lactobacillus reuteri, in the gut of the mice that triggered an immune response leading to the disease. Specifically, in the Toll-like receptor 7 (TLR7)-dependent mouse models of lupus, L. reuteri stimulated immune cells known as dendritic cells, as well as immune system pathways that exacerbated disease development."

https://raypeatforum.com/community/threads/a-common-probiotic-strain-lactobacillus-may-cause-lupus.27085/

###### this sux cuz I want a quick fix for my infectious problems

I'm not beyond looking for some evidence that results can be safely found in moderation.

I agree with Mauritio and don't find these issues too concerning, but it's good to know what it's doing. Lactate production may have a temporary antimicrobial effect, which would help to eliminate pathogens. If for some reason it disturbs the gut afterwards, the person can try to recolonize it with other microbes. Lactate can also be cleared locally before absorption.

I think that a greater concern would be the competition for vitamins that occur in the gut and eventually depleting those that are already low. Stuffing yourself with probiotics may call for temporary use of topical vitamins.

Mauritio

@Amazoniac are you aware of any vitamins that L. reuteri consumes?
I only recall reading about it producing B12, but other than that I haven't come across anything like that.

LetTheRedeemed

@Amazoniac interesting. Thank you much brother.

Funny, I’m quoting these old rpf threads to y'all, but y'all were in them lol @Mauritio

Mauritio

L. Reuteri 6475 potently increases the serotonin Transporter SERT, which picks up serotonin and thereby reduces its availability.
They also showed that it reduced colitis in a rat model and lowered inflammatory cytokines like IFNy or TNF.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34550056/

DSM 17938, the other strain in Bio Gaia's Gastrus, also decreases serotonin. In this case directly.
Interestingly the effect took a while to show,but after that inertia, the longer they took it the more it lowered serotonin.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30574801/

Ismail

@Mauritio have you increased your dose bud? (From a fourth of a tablet)

How much is everyone else taking? I know @Amazoniac is eating the yoghurt, is anyone else doing this too?

Mauritio

@Ismail yes I increased to 3/4 of a tablet and will increase further soon.

Amazoniac

@Mauritio said in L. Reuteri:

@Amazoniac are you aware of any vitamins that L. reuteri consumes?
I only recall reading about it producing B12, but other than that I haven't come across anything like that.

I don't, but it's something to consider if the person starts to notice negative effects. The problem is that the bacteria can't be considered in isolation, what matters is the result of its addition. L. reuteri might consume a vitamin, but promote the growth of producers that make up for it. Rate of production also matters: there can be substitution for consumers that use up little of it in relation to the previous colony. Competition is likely harsher between microbes than with the host. Therefore, if someone doesn't notice gut issues, gross depletions might not be a concern for this individual.

DavidPS

L. Reuteri is part of our historical gut microbiome. It has always been present in all mammals. In recent decades, it has become very hard to find in the human gut. The new normal is not to have reuteri present in our gut. It is thought that our modern lifestyle (highly processed foods, antibiotics, the over use of herbicide and pesticides, improved hygiene, chlorinated water) is the cause for this loss of diveristy in our microbiome.

Restoring reuteri is a hack for increasing our testosterone levels. It seems that it is simply restoring our testosterone levels in the direction to the levels to what they were for hundreds/thousands of years.

Role of Lactobacillus reuteri in Human Health and Diseases

Mauritio

@Amazoniac I noticed some transient vitamin B2 and biotin deficiency symptoms.
Although I suspect that's more due to killing the bacteria that produce those vitamins via reuterin.

Mauritio

In this study another L. Reuteri strain 36301, caused a Testosterone increase of about 250%, in males that is. In females it caused shinier hair and skin and no testosterone increase.
It also reduced weight gain during aging and the inflammatory cytokines TNFa .

In the OP of this thread the testosterone increase was dependant on IL-10 , while in this study they did not find a difference in that marker, so there has to be another mechanism of action.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4837529/

DavidPS

Intake of Lactobacillus reuteri improves incretin and insulin secretion in glucose-tolerant humans: a proof of concept

Results: In glucose-tolerant volunteers, daily administration of L. reuteri SD5865 increased glucose-stimulated GLP-1 and GLP-2 release by 76% (P < 0.01) and 43% (P < 0.01), respectively, compared with placebo, along with 49% higher insulin (P < 0.05) and 55% higher C-peptide secretion (P < 0.05). However, the intervention did not alter peripheral and hepatic insulin sensitivity, body mass, ectopic fat content, or circulating cytokines.